The real reason 'PC gaming is dying'

[PsY X]

Alright, I would LOVE to discuss this with some people who know something about the current state of the industry. We all know piracy is a problem, but that's not what I'm here to discuss. Has anyone checked out gamesforwindows.com?

Here's my take on it. PC gaming has always had console ports. Historically, very few ports were considered good games. Games typically do better if they're designed for their platform (correct me if I'm wrong). Now we have this "Games for Windows" that appeared about the same time I started hearing all the "PC gaming is dying" talk. Fact is, PC gaming sales are in the billions, and they went up from last year. This GFW seems to me like a port-machine for Xbox 360. It also requires compatibility with the 360 controller.

Now, people that read these forums and I know that PC games look a hell of a lot better than their console versions (cept Bioshock for SOME reason). Joe Consumer, on the other hand, has a choice to make. He sees "Games for Windows" and could assume that it's a PC game and anything that doesn't have that logo must not be authentic. That limits his picks to GFW games. J.C. may not be tech savvy but he isn't stupid. He weighs his options. He looks at a game for both PC and Xbox 360, let's say Overlord, or Bioshock, doesn't matter. Both say you can use a controller, however J.C. realizes he would be more comfortable sitting on the couch. Looking at the graphics, J.C. doesn't see much of a difference. Then J.C. looks at the system requirements and finds it would be cheaper to buy an Xbox360 AND a low end HDTV than it would be to upgrade his current system.

It could be argued that without GFW we wouldn't have seen games like Bioshock or Overlord on PC and that would have hurt more. I don't agree. I think because of the ports being so similar and the massive amount of marketing going into them, would-be PC gamers are turning to Xbox (or ps3). I think all the 'PC gaming is dying' talk started when GFW started. The comparisons were too hard to make until GFW turned PC gaming into a more or less XBox emulation platform. I can see the ideas for it, make one game and sell it on more than your own platform, make extra $$. If the plan was to get people to buy two copies of these games, I don't see that happening.

Clearly, the main reason people are PC gamers in the first place is either for the controls, the graphics, or the ability to play online with a massive group of people. If everything is the same, the Xbox gets the advantage for being a couch/TV system.

Again I agree piracy is a problem and it's turning developers away from PC gaming, but nobody so far has even looked into this other issue. I really am looking for a meaningful discussion here, if you're gonna flame me keep it out of the thread thx.

 

[ph33rgear]

ughhh no, GFW main purpose is not to be a port machine for xb360...

The purpose of it is to set an industry standard. You buy a game for xbox 360 or PS3 you go home unwrap it, pop it in and start playing.

That's more or less what the purpose is, to set a standard set of hardware specs for the games to run on.

So basically if your PC can run windows vista, you can run any game with the GFW logo on it. They want to make it as convienant to install and play the games as possible, not everyone like us hardcore PC gamers want to play with settings, tweak things etc..

Don't get me wrong I have no doubt in my mind that M$ has alterior motives and a hidden agenda in all this, but that's the simple fact of it.

It had nothing to do with piracy, although a problem of course.. The main goal was to make it as easy as possible for joe consumer to purchase a game and start playing it as hassle free as possible on his somewhat basic hardware and not have to upgrade everytime a game somes out.

Same idea behind the PC Gaming Alliance, they want to set a standard and help slowdown the hardware arms race between companies, that in turn make your 6 month old video card look like a pos.

They as well want to set a standard, but trying to work with the main companies too, for instance intel... and their onboard graphics, which is absolute crap. Then joe consumer thinks he can buy this budget gaming system with onboard graphics then go play the latest games... well clearly we all know that aint going to work...

Like mentioned in another thread I think Steam (valve) has a really big opportunity here. I hope that they can make it work and jump in it, which they prob are but who knows. If they can make steam the super friendly game consultant, then they will gain the respect of gamers and grab a HUGE marketshare...

For instance like discussed before, if they could tell you (which they can cuz steam is pretty intrusive in respect to analyizing your PC specs) how well a game will run before you even buy it, well that will be an amazing feature and no need for GFW now. SURE some people won't buy a game because they can't play it on their hardware but at least they didnt have to purchase the game for 50$ to find out.

This way they avoid people bashing and bad mouth devs,publishers etc.. and are happy at least they knew before they paid for it.. it's the best of both worlds, hardcore gamers will be fine as they are, and the not so hardcore who aren't going to update their pc once a year, let alone a couple times like the hardcore won't be left paying for games they can't play.

They will at least know where they stand and what it will take to let them play this game. VIA updateing hardware if they want to play a game badly enough.

There is alot more to all this but I think that GFW is a croc for the most part and a failure. Only because M$ has done squat all with it, such a big build up and announcments etc.. then nothing...

anyways, this topic can get thrown around back and forth alot... it sure is the hot one at the moment...

but PC Gaming is Alive! more then ever!

 

[mudlab]

like many things, this is an issue of interconnected relations. to play the newest, most graphically-intense games for PC, your machine has to be suitably high-end to give the user a smooth presentation (i.e. no lag, good framerates, pseudo-realistic graphics). this either requires john doe to buy a "high end" pre-built system (i.e. dell, etc.) or invest a substantial amount of time and money into building a custom system on his own.

enter current console hardware. while not being upgradable (for the most part), consoles have an edge in presenting the latest games in that their developers write the game around the console's capabilities. this is not to say that console games don't lag, but that's another story.

ever notice how PC gamers are looked at far differently than console gamers? that's not an accident. generating mass appeal for consoles means console developers/publishers have to make console gamers non-pariahs. look at the amount of commercials for console games vs. PC games, and the types of commercials for each. on a related note (with a nod to the "couch gaming" idea), console gaming is seen as much more of a socially involving activity, since many games are designed for 2 or more players on the same console. kinda hard to play much of anything split-screen on a PC nowadays.

so, while the general public knows little to nothing about building a gaming machine or even what RAM is, they can look at a game released on both xbox 360 and PC and make the "obvious" choice as a consumer: the console is a one-time investment, it's more socially acceptable to play, and the game doesn't need to be installed or patched (usually). simplicity, as far as john doe is concerned. this is exact mindset console games target.

relating more directly to the GFW branding: the more I see it, the more I think it's just another way microsoft is trying to force the conversion to vista. no, GFW games aren't vista-only, but judging by their list of supposed benefits, not much else stands out. "tested rigorously?" does that mean the game has no bugs and never needs to be patched? "easy to play?" (which translates to "easy to install/uninstall, especially under vista") are they really trying to tell us that previous games weren't easy enough to install or uninstall? in my opinion, GFW is the same thing as "the way it's meant to be played": nothing more than marketing.

 

[purplerat]

Now we have this "Games for Windows" that appeared about the same time I started hearing all the "PC gaming is dying" talk.

People have been saying PC gaming is dying much longer than when GFW first appeared. GFW is more like a very late response to years of people saying PC gaming is dying. You can debate whether GFW is good for PC gaming or not (I think it is), but the trend that PC gaming has been going in started years before GFW was even thought of.

 

[ph33rgear]

ever notice how PC gamers are looked at far differently than console gamers? that's not an accident. generating mass appeal for consoles means console developers/publishers have to make console gamers non-pariahs. look at the amount of commercials for console games vs. PC games, and the types of commercials for each. on a related note (with a nod to the "couch gaming" idea), console gaming is seen as much more of a socially involving activity, since many games are designed for 2 or more players on the same console. kinda hard to play much of anything split-screen on a PC nowadays.

This may also have to do with the fact that PC gamers usually are in front of their PC's not a TV... wasted money.

When they game is for all platforms well then it's just a bonus, but you didn't see Crysis ads on television did you?

well at least I didn't but then again, i fall into the PC gamer in front of my pc, not a tv.

 

[Cuddles]

PC Gaming isn't dying.
Steam just crossed the 15 million user mark in March with a total , total sales of PC Games in the last 3 months out paced all the console sales combined, and Microsoft just announced their vision for Games for Windows including addressing some confusion on Windows Live and how it's a free service for Windows Vista owners.
The facts are Windows is Bill Gates baby. This was the baby that made him who he is today. He isn't going to let it die. X-box was something to help them get to where they wanted Windows to be which is a multi-functional OS that could compete with anything and everything. People talk about what a crap product Vista is but these people haven't delved deep into the OS. Microsoft Synch was developed for Vista and then ported to cars, Windows Live was beta and made primarily for Vista (that GfW has way more use than what people thought), and then there is the phasing out of 16 bit crappy installers and drivers.
Now we look at what consoles bring for Gamers and it's little improvement on the past but PC Gaming is always expanding and growing. PC Games have driven the tech that makes consoles able to exist in their current form as it is today. Without PC Games the Console Market would still be at the Sega Genesis Level. We may hate the fact that every year we have to buy the newest and best Graphics card to continue playing the games we love but it's this ever expanding growth that has driven our technological advances. Without this all Gaming would stagnate and die.
Then we look at Sony's Gaming Department and it's inability to get out of the Red, Microsoft has stated publicly that they take a loss on every console that is bought, and the only company to actually report a profit for their console business is Nintendo.
The biggest problem with PC Gaming was Piracy but even that is going to be addressed as the PC Gaming Alliance begins to take shape. Who is heading the PC Gaming Alliance? Microsoft.
This is it for Consoles. They had their day but it's over. They have hit a mark where every Console produces a negative profit. Sony will port over to their own brand of Computers running ReactOS or Linux with Wine, Nintendo will continue on their mark of producing a Console for Family oriented and Group play, and X-box will fade into Windows.
For PC Gaming to die then PC's would have to die and that would mean Windows would have to die. That's not going to happen. The only reason people think Vista is a crap OS is that only a few people have actually delved deep enough into it to see all the features it does have. With SSD's coming down in price the 15 second from turn on to full function is here. It takes 30 seconds to install Vista from start to finish with a SSD. That's installing.
PC Gaming is just getting started. It's going to get pretty interesting in the next ten years.

 

[mudlab]

I didn't see any crysis ads either. I do, however, remember f.e.a.r. ads...then again f.e.a.r. was not only on PC...

 

[purplerat]

There were Crysis TV ads. I remember seeing them on both G4 and FX. However between the release of the demo and the full game being such flops it's probably more likely that EA pulled the ads to cut their losses on a game that just wasn't going to catch on. WoW ads are on all the time though as are The Sims for PC only games. Not a lot of other major titles are PC only anymore though.

 

[mudlab]

This is it for Consoles. They had their day but it's over.

hard to believe, considering the recent sales of gta 4, halo 3, CoD 4, etc. both microsoft and sony have stated that their consoles are on a 5-year cycle. over? I think we're far from that. both PC gaming and console gaming are coming into their own, but ultimately it'll be sales that determine who remains years down the line.

 

[Cuddles]

Unless Sony can show a positive influx of cash from Playstation Sales it should be over but I just don't see it happening for them. Right now they are loosing around a $100.00 per sale of Console. Microsoft's X-Box 360 has already lost Billions for Microsoft and they were loosing a little over $100.00 per Console before the recent price drop. I can't even imagine the loss they are taking with X-Box 360 right now but if they have played it smart they will use it as a Tax Right Off and use their Gaming Department to show plus positive figures. Microsoft unlike Sony though has one of the best Gaming Departments in the Industry while Sony has one of the worst. I think Microsoft was looking at the bigger picture years ago and done a pretty good job of destroying their main OS Gaming competition. Nintendo was a suprise but I think Microsoft will let them be. There is a need for consoles and Nintendo does a good job in filling in that niche.

 

[psymanproductions]

the reason pc gaming is dying is because for the average gamer doesnt want to spend two hundred quid on a graphics card every six months and probabarly wouldnt know how to install it anyway, pc gaming is too complex and expensive for most (i think).

the other reason is that the kind of guy who knows how to do the techie stuff involved in building and maintaining a gaming rig also knows where to get his games for free... dont tell me you dont you liars!

i was thinking, how could the pc gaming industry fight piracy more effectively and make it easier for the average user?

well what about games for windows introducing a piece of software that essensialy turns almost ANY pc into a gaming console, install the software and run the games straight from the disk as consoles do? granted it would have to run on a wide range of systems(even ones with intergrated graphics, eeek!) and this will be the biggest hurdle i think. but if there was something like that which updated itself automatically, adjusted graphics properties automaticaly, had a universial controller that just plugged straight into usb with out drivers or time consuming button mapping needed i think they would be able to sell more.

the adition of the universial controller, specialy designed for the platform would also enable them to perhaps put some kind of security chip in the controller so games will not run unless you buy the controller,

theres my crazy idea anyway....

 

[Oh Snap]

I think I'd just quit playing games if they did something like that.

 

[psymanproductions]

I think I'd just quit playing games if they did something like that.

yea i mean hav that simple plaform open for the ametures who dont like messing with pcs and obvously there will still be the market of power hungry games that demand high speed pcs to run but look beautifull. i would also be gutted if they introduced that security system i mentioned, but it would prolly cut down on piracy, look at the professional audio editing programs like cubase 4, you have to buy a security dongle for the software to work, cubase 4 hasnt been cracked yet so maybe this would be worth is to stop piracy and thats a good thing? (for the people making and sellin games obviously) were not gunna benifit from the meney they make straight away, but if pc gaming becomes more profitable we would have big titles like gta iv running on our machines right now..... probabarly

 

[mothhive]

How about a compromise? Sony, Microsoft and Nintendo keep making their consoles with their fixed specs, but have them basically be mini PCs (pretty much there right now) and have all games developers create a single version of each game that you could use in any one of the consoles or PC. The games would all be compatible with the consoles, with the software detecting which one is running it and adjusting the settings to run optimally on that console or, if it's a PC, allow the user to customise as they do now. That could also work for activating/deactivating console/PC specific features, but in the end, we'd all get basically the same game on the same disk for the same price. The consoles could still differentiate themselves from each other with different controllers/graphics/online capabilities/etc and anyone who wants to put a bit more time, money and effort into their gaming can stick with their PCs.

Is that just a crazy dream? An unreachable gaming eutopia? I hope not! Thinking about it right now, it's utterly baffling to me that we don't already have universal games like this. Look at the way you watch movies at home. From a cheapo £50 player, to an expensive £xxxx full home entertainment system, they all take the same discs and the experience is pretty much the same (with varying quality though, obviously), but that's how it should be with games. I'm tired of needing several systems to play a few games when any of them are capabable of running them, just because some company bought the exclusive rights. It's time games were made for gamers, not just to make money from them!

 

[psymanproductions]

How about a compromise? Sony, Microsoft and Nintendo keep making their consoles with their fixed specs, but have them basically be mini PCs (pretty much there right now) and have all games developers create a single version of each game that you could use in any one of the consoles or PC. The games would all be compatible with the consoles, with the software detecting which one is running it and adjusting the settings to run optimally on that console or, if it's a PC, allow the user to customise as they do now. That could also work for activating/deactivating console/PC specific features, but in the end, we'd all get basically the same game on the same disk for the same price. The consoles could still differentiate themselves from each other with different controllers/graphics/online capabilities/etc and anyone who wants to put a bit more time, money and effort into their gaming can stick with their PCs.

Is that just a crazy dream? An unreachable gaming eutopia? I hope not! Thinking about it right now, it's utterly baffling to me that we don't already have universal games like this. Look at the way you watch movies at home. From a cheapo £50 player, to an expensive £xxxx full home entertainment system, they all take the same discs and the experience is pretty much the same (with varying quality though, obviously), but that's how it should be with games. I'm tired of needing several systems to play a few games when any of them are capabable of running them, just because some company bought the exclusive rights. It's time games were made for gamers, not just to make money from them!

that would be soo good for the consumer... i agree totaly with your idea, the only problem is that consoles like the ps3 would die, theres no way sony and nintendo would buy into thiis 'cos they'd loose money.

i think if this happened, and all games and consoles beame x86/x64 based so they could run the same disk on a pc as a console, sony for example would come up against competition from dell, hp, pretty much any one who can build a pc! right now i doubt sony and nintendo have the ability to build pc as cheap as a company like dell as thats all they specialise in.

but then again, as you said, sony and nintendo could capture a market by hiring IBM, nividia or amd/ati to build customised x86/x64 chips that exell in gaming... thats how they currently source their chips but i dont think they are x86/x64 based... so cant run windows and you cant run the games on a normal machine without a slow emulator. plus they av the option to develop better controll systems, networking abilities and even customised operating systems o run games faster and make the whle thing easier...

i dont know but it would be brill if that happened

 

[Oh Snap]

It'd never happen though. Companies wouldn't work together like that because they couldn't count on revenue from exclusive titles like Halo. It'd be cool, but honestly corporations are far more concerned with their financial success than with the overall success of the industry. That's just the way it is.

 

[Heyyou27]

I didn't see any crysis ads either. I do, however, remember f.e.a.r. ads...then again f.e.a.r. was not only on PC...

F.E.A.R. released on the PC a year before the Xbox360, and the PS3 version came out even later than that.

 

[infornography42]

well what about games for windows introducing a piece of software that essensialy turns almost ANY pc into a gaming console, install the software and run the games straight from the disk as consoles do? granted it would have to run on a wide range of systems(even ones with intergrated graphics, eeek!) and this will be the biggest hurdle i think. but if there was something like that which updated itself automatically, adjusted graphics properties automaticaly, had a universial controller that just plugged straight into usb with out drivers or time consuming button mapping needed i think they would be able to sell more.

the adition of the universial controller, specialy designed for the platform would also enable them to perhaps put some kind of security chip in the controller so games will not run unless you buy the controller,

theres my crazy idea anyway....

THIS.... This right here is why PC gaming is diminishing (I won't say dying because it isn't). Companies are becoming so obsessed with fighting piracy that they aren't noticing all of the honest gamers that they are alienating and thereby driving either to consoles or away from gaming altogether. DRM is the cause of the diminishing market.

Many people might not have even realized that this was the reason. Many console gamers I have talked to have quoted instability as the main reason why they left PC gaming for consoles. That instability was often caused by shoddy DRM. Now with the new versions of Securom rearing their ugly heads, more savvy PC gamers are starting to think the grass looks awfully green on the consoles these days.

And the most frustrating part is that the DRM isn't even doing any good. It is just outright absurd. Why do they spend so much money on alienating their audience for no discernible benefit?

 

[PsY X]

amdfangirl: Look, here's more on the Bioware DRM case http://www.fudzilla.com/index.php? [...] 5&Itemid=1
Blacklisting? have they really lost it?

yeah, they probably have. Games are getting insanely time consuming/expensive to create, and every minute and dollar spent on anti-piracy is a minute and a dollar taken away from the games' quality.

I'm really trying here to not turn this into a piracy/anti-piracy debate... I bought Crysis and Call of Duty 4, but I've also pirated so I'm not really biased. I'd just like to say that I really do believe that SecuRom or ANY DRM is just as bad as piracy to begin with. People who really want the game will get over it to play it, but it still makes things a pain in the ass and will probably drive a few people away from the game, or PC gaming in general.

Back on topic anyways... I think the point made earlier about a game working on every platform would be a mistake. We as PC gamers sacrifice couch comfort and ease of use for specific PC features. The more PC games become like console games, the more people will want to switch over. 90% of people would not be able to tell the difference between UT3 on a PS3 at 1080p (whew, acronyms!) vs UT3 on a PC at 1920x1200. Technical superiority is NOT an advantage unless it means running a game that no other system can run (Crysis). Make a new game like Bioshock or Call of Duty 4 that runs on PC and the consoles, give them the same control options (xbox 360 controller for windows), and you have a problem. Why would people bother upgrading their PC, setting up the game, and dealing with the DRM when they could just throw the game in their console and play it from the couch, with the SAME exact experience! Now throw piracy into the mix.... that's my point. Piracy is a problem but these people are starting to use it as a scapegoat for ALL problems.

 

[PsY X]

Just one more thing about the piracy/DRM debate, both sides are way off. P2P technology is only going to get better, consoles aren't immune from it either. There has to be a way to deal with it other than treating everyone like a pirate (DRM, Comcast throttling P2P) or trying to claim some moral superiority (piracy is a crusade vs X company!) There is a way to deal with it... is there some kind of problem with steam? Why doesn't everyone take this approach? There's an offline mode so you can play without internet (seems to be a main topic of debate). As far as I know, you could still get a hardcopy of the game if retailers released some sort of "steam" version or whatever they wanted to come up with. Wheres the problem?

 

[yamagiru]

First there was Pong, the begining of our epic Odyssey, and all was well.

Then cometh Atari 2600, TI-99, Intelevision and the start of our Odyssey²! Though they whom are your forefathers cometh onto the scene the almighty PC stood as a great stone wall until them who did cometh are no more.

Then they of the third generation stood to fight King PC; Atari 7600, Sega, NES and his little game boy to. Though hey fought valiantly and much was the lamentation for the death of the King, still he stood.

Not long after the third epic war did the scoundrels come forth in new terror as Sega Mega drive and Super NES come with a plot to foil the King, again, which failed, ho hum.......

Down through the ages have they come, now to the seventh war; Xbox 360, Sony's PS3, Wii. Surely now with their combined might the King shall surely fall. It is a dark day my friends, a time of chaos.

For those whom are faithful, we await the return of the King..........

 

[rayzor]

While piracy is definitely a factor in the recent (and hopefully not permanent) PC gaming slump, I think a more significant cause is the 'Average Joe.' I think it's safe to say that the majority of video game purchasers (for all platforms combined) would gladly sacrifice graphical quality and options for ease of use. The truth is, the typical game consumer just wants to plop down on his/her couch and play Madden or something along those lines. If he is in the store weighing the decision to buy a pc or console game, he is going to avoid the platform on which he tried for three hours to install Far Cry, but failed because "something about having integrated graphics" kept him from doing it. Based on my friends' and relatives' opinions and questions I get about computers/pc gaming, I think it's safe to say that many, many consumers have been literally scared away from pc gaming.

Let me share an experience I had when I was rather young. For some reason, I was totally psyched about Medal of Honor: Allied Assault when it came out. I asked for it for my birthday several months in advance, and sure enough, I got it!

Then I went to install it...

Being raised with a Nintendo 64, I knew virtually nothing about computers, and so i didn't even think to check any specs on the box (i didn't even know what most of them meant anyway). So after months of anticipation, i go to install, load up the game and....the sound doesn't work! So I spend literally several hours of frustration before I finally figure out that maybe i need to update my audio driver. I do this, restart my computer, and load up the game. The sound is working...i'm ready to roll!! I watch excitedly as the loading bar moves across the screen to load the first level...here it comes...here it comes....BSOD! I try again, this time, no BSOD, but the game crashes back to desktop.

I tried everything in my twelve year old power to fix this, but i just didn't know what i was doing. Turns out I had an old computer with integrated graphics and not a snowball's chance in hell of running any 3-d game after 1999. But i just gave up...didn't even consider buying another pc game til 2005, when I started to teach myself about computers.

Most 'Average Joes' who have ever tried to buy a pc game with the expectation that it will run well (if at all) just because they own a computer have had a similar experience and have thus been scared away from pc gaming. This is why I believe PC gaming is slumping currently, but, as always, I think it is the true home of innovation in gaming, and I don't think it is 'dying' as many have been claiming for years and years.

Solutions? Well first of all, as someone stated above, all players in the pc game industry (software developers, chip makers, computer manufacturers) need to get together and agree to some level of standardization and cooperation in terms of compatibility and ease of use. The 'average joe' hasn't the faintest clue how to update his drivers (let alone what the hell a driver even is). Nor does he have any idea how to install a new video card or ram.

Also, game developers need to get a grip on hardware requirements. While I was a big fan of Crysis, I hate to say it, but games like that scare the living crap out of the average consumer. This also (in part) explains the popularity of World of Warcraft. It is so scalable to older systems, that the vast majority of PC users have virtually no problem running it. While I love to see new graphical technology, I think the PC gaming industry got a little ahead of itself and in doing so alienated many consumers.

 

[Cuddles]

I agree with everything you have said Rayzor but look at how far PC Gaming has came since it's inception. Now you compare it to Books, Movies, TV, Cars, Trains, Air Travel, and you suddenly see that if PC Gaming has came this far in such the short amount of time since it's birth just imagine what it will look like in just another ten to fifteen years.
Now I really want everyone here to retake a look at Microsoft Vista and what it trully brings. I wasn't a fan of Microsoft. I really wanted to go to Lepord but as a Gaming OS it failed. I went to Linux and it failed. I had XP but routine bad hardware drivers, Creatives Monopoly hold on Audio, and the want of a more robust and secure OS forced me to try Vista.
Vista opened some good doors and closed some bad ones.
I'm not saying every piece of Hardware that is Vista certified is going to be good but it is bringing that across the board standard that is so sorely needed for PC Gaming to the forefront. What it's not doing is restricting Hardware Growth as Apples Mac OS does. In fact quite the opposite. For how many years has Creative had a strangle hold on the PC Audio Selection and now that Vista has arrived we are seeing bigger and better Audio Cards than we have ever seen before.
I'm not saying that Vista is for everyone but it is the step in the right direction. In fact quite the opposite. Do not move towards Vista until you do have all the Hardware that can run it. If you do you are asking for Headaches and Heartache you just can't even begin to fathom. But if you were like me where you just needed to make a big huge push into new Hardware then Vista should be something you should really consider.
Vista probably won't be the OS that brings a complete standard like everyone here would like but it is a big step in the right direction.
Let's also don't loose sight that there will be certain companies who hate change and we will see die. Right now I think we are at that point. Broadband is growing in an unbelievable direction. Where Movies and Games were safe it isn't so much so now. What the Music Industry faced with the emergence of the Internet these companies are just facing right now. Where the Music Companies thought it was the end it was just the begining to something bigger and better than before. Music CD's are still here and Piracy is even a worse problem with Music than it is with PC Games. Most people hate stealing but more people hate being ripped off and for to long it has been to easy for these Companies to rip off the Consumer.
When Starcraft 2 comes out we'll see how many people are saying PC Gaming is dead then and we'll also see if Blizzard is saying "The reason we failed is because of Piracy."
People have and always will reward Companies huge rewards for quality products and that's just the way it is.

 

[nachowarrior]

pc gaming is really just beginning.... People are becoming more 'tech savvy' via the people around them like you and I. I taught 70 year old woman how to shop for a new tv once... Sooner or later people are going to start realizing that consoles are a load of bs. You get a game box.... you build a pc, sans the video card you pay a few bucks FOR A PC, not for a game box... but you have said pc... no compare game box, to ploping a video card into your pc, dollar for dollar. pc wins out, and is soooooo much more flexible on price... it's just that these people don't know what they need. The majority of the public are morons when it comes to just about anything technical unless it's in their specific field...and even then... it's questionable. I've mentioned this over and over again....why does it still come up? Why would a soccer mom want to hear their retarded kids whine and bitch because the lot of them are too ignorant and don't require the intelligence to install a pc game? WHY! neither the kid, nor the parent knows how to do it... they won't teach your kids in school... it's become a BASIC SKILL in our society to manipulate and troubleshoot hardware and software... but MOST PEOPLE JUST CAN'T DO IT! this is one of your biggest reasons nobody buys pc games.... so quit arguing.... people go the extra mile for an extraordinary experience, they don't go out of their way however if they don't know what the hell their doing...

anyway, start the bitchfest........................................NOW!

 

[nachowarrior]

oh and ps: vista isn't a step in the right direction. People have limited amount of money that they will spend for a particular experience of any kind. Be it a movie, or mountain climbing, canoing or gaming. Linux based gaming would be a step in the right direction. eg. buy a gaming console get the software and hardware. buy/build a pc, get the the hardware, pay extra for the software. So that brings the price point way down. I support linux 100%... and it's because it just requires less hardware to do the same job, and it does it better. It's also more flexible. Having said that, i know it has it's problems and it's hurtles to leap... But I just think the statement "vista is a step in the right direction" is backwards as far as the overall industry goes, and what consumers really want. People want freedom... not confinement that they have to pay for... Having said that, the IDEA of a more standardized platform is correct based on my previous post. To make the big bucks, it needs to be easy, it needs to work well, work all the time, and be an impressive improvement over all the competition. So you are right in that aspect.

k, game is done downloading on steam, later!