If you were considering an i3: Haswell details.

[8350rocks]

http://wccftech.com/idf-2013-intel-details-haswell-microarchitecture-overclocking-features-4th-generation-hd-graphics-core/

I have been saying for sometime that dual core CPUs are going the way of the dodo. Intel is only releasing i3 CPUs for mobile platforms with haswell.

Those of you that were considering an i3, please reconsider and go to a quad core of some kind. It doesn't have to be an AMD, but even intel has conceded a dual core is no longer sufficient.

The SKUs are listed at the bottom for desktop then mobile.

Note: all the laptop/mobile variants are listed at the very bottom and are followed by a "U" in the nomenclature. The desktop models with "R" nomenclature are BGA - meaning the CPU is soldered to the motherboard (no socket).

 

[whyso]

http://wccftech.com/idf-2013-intel-details-haswell-microarchitecture-overclocking-features-4th-generation-hd-graphics-core/

I have been saying for sometime that dual core CPUs are going the way of the dodo. Intel is only releasing i3 CPUs for mobile platforms with haswell.

Those of you that were considering an i3, please reconsider and go to a quad core of some kind. It doesn't have to be an AMD, but even intel has conceded a dual core is no longer sufficient.

The SKUs are listed at the bottom for desktop then mobile.

Note: all the laptop/mobile variants are listed at the very bottom and are followed by a "U" in the nomenclature. The desktop models with "R" nomenclature are BGA - meaning the CPU is soldered to the motherboard (no socket).

Ivy bridge i3 launched months after the i5/i7 chips.

I believe the SKU details were also not available at launch.

 

[jaguarskx]

There is one dual core desktop Haswell CPU listed in the article, the Core i5-4570T. Two cores, four threads, 35w TDP.

As stated above, I believe Core i3 CPUs were released at a later date so I would not count them out just yet.

I wonder if Lenovo will give an option for the Core i7-4850HQ CPU in their ThinkPad T series.....

 

[8350rocks]

Well, this would confirm another article I read a while back (cannot find the link at the moment), that said essentially that intel was going to go away from desktop i3 CPUs entirely...(with the exception of BGA solutions for small business/low end solutions)

 

[RobCrezz]

I would be surprised if they did get rid of the desktop i3, surely its a big seller isn't it?

 

[8350rocks]

I would be surprised if they did get rid of the desktop i3, surely its a big seller isn't it?

For consumer CPU buyers? Not so much. For OEMs building $500 desktops to sell? Sure...that's why making them BGA doesn't hurt i3 sales much at all. It pushes enthusiasts they think are loyal only to intel to a higher product with better margins, and leaves OEMs with the capability to produce the same $500 desktop. It just means prebuilt i3 systems will not be upgradeable. You'll have to buy a new PC, again making intel more money.

From a business standpoint it makes perfect sense. Systems become more disposable...so it will "spur growth" if the consumer cannot upgrade their cheap desktop PC without having to purchase entirely new components or, some consumers will just buy a new system.

 

[jaguarskx]

Per the following article about "Leaked Haswell Prices" there are five desktop Haswell Core i3 CPUs; Core i3-4240T, Core i3-4240, Core i3-4225, Core i3-4220T,Core i3-4220. The information is not concrete yet though which would make sense especially if they are going to be released later in 2013.

http://www.technationnews.com/2013/04/22/intel-haswell-desktop-cpu-prices-leaked-flagship-core-i7-4770k-to-cost-327/

"Leaked Price" for the i7-4770k is $327 and the i5-4670k is $227.

 

[8350rocks]

Does it specify LGA or BGA for the i3 series? (Cannot load the article from work, the firewall dislikes that site I guess)

 

[RobCrezz]

Does it specify LGA or BGA for the i3 series? (Cannot load the article from work, the firewall dislikes that site I guess)

It seems to imply both.

 

[jaguarskx]

Does it specify LGA or BGA for the i3 series? (Cannot load the article from work, the firewall dislikes that site I guess)

LGA is implied since BGA versions are designated with the letter "R".

I listed the five Haswell Core i3 CPUs listed in the article in my prior post. None of them are "R" models, therefore the logical conclusion is that they are socket 1150.

 

[8350rocks]

Well, so be it...

Even so, with the state of things today...a dual core still does not cut it.

 

[ramon zarat]

I disagree.

In the corporate space, especially in the SMB segment where the budgets are low and PC are often glorified typewriter with only e-mail, MS Word and the accounting software being of use, an high clock / low cost i3 with hyper-threading is more than enough to give good performance for a 5 years cycle.

Take for example the HP Deskpro series with the 4300 small form factor model. It's the cheapest PC I know that comes with 3 years of next business day on-site warranty, upgradable to 5 years. I sell those like hot cakes and customers really appreciate the value, build quality and out of the box 3 years coverage. Performance is never an issue.

 

[8350rocks]

I was not discussing commercial solutions, I was directly addressing the community of gamers. As most people looking for a "glorified typewriter" buy an HP/Dell/etc. and don't bother building their own PC to begin with.

 

[logainofhades]

Intel doesn't have a single i3 on their Haswell list. Plenty of unlaunched i5 and i7 and Xeon though.

http://ark.intel.com/products/codename/42174/Haswell

 

[InvalidError]

Intel doesn't have a single i3 on their Haswell list. Plenty of unlaunched i5 and i7 and Xeon though.

Give it another 2-3 months. As others have said, Intel almost always launch higher-end parts first just like how AMD and Nvidia usually introduce their high-end GPUs first.

Makes sense to me: somewhat limited availability due to production still in early ramp-up, low-end prebuilt manufacturers not necessarily in much of a hurry to re-tool their low-end assembly lines and the higher-end is far more likely to be itching for upgrades or new systems than the low-end also contribute to wanting to chase those higher-margin sales first.

 

[8350rocks]

I could see that ringing true...they want to scalp people for $340 a pop before the word about hasfail gets too far and consumers realize what hasfail really is: A higher power consumption IB with a die shrink and a marginal iGPU tweak.

 

[InvalidError]

I could see that ringing true...they want to scalp people for $340 a pop before the word about hasfail gets too far and consumers realize what hasfail really is: A higher power consumption IB with a die shrink and a marginal iGPU tweak.

Haswell is 22nm just like Ivy Bridge, there is no die shrink. The die shrink is next year with Broadwell on 14nm.

Most people do not run their CPUs anywhere near 100% load most of the time and most of the PC market is non-gamer non-enthusiast so for the vast majority of people, Haswell's much lower idle power is much more significant than its 7W higher TDP. There is also a 30W discrepancy between motherboards with the highest and lowest load power, indicating that motherboard VRM and other components also have a significant impact on Haswell's overall efficiency.

The only people who can call it "Hasfail" are enthusiasts. For everyone else, it is generally at least just as good as any other Intel CPUs currently on the market.

 

[8350rocks]

I thought this cycle was a die shrink?! Oh well...no matter anyway...that makes the difference even less.

 

[RobCrezz]

I could see that ringing true...they want to scalp people for $340 a pop before the word about hasfail gets too far and consumers realize what hasfail really is: A higher power consumption IB with a die shrink and a marginal iGPU tweak.

Hahaha! You really are the biggest AMD Fanboi!

 

[jaguarskx]

"Hasfail" is nowhere near as bad as Bulldozer where performance gain expectations were reported as high as 50%. AMD's goal with Bulldozer was to increase performance so many people believed there would be a good performance increase. Don't know what those people who were expecting performance gains as high as 50% were smoking.

Intel never really focused on the CPU performance increase of Haswell from the start. All the official slides I've seen from Intel did not list CPU performance as a bullet point. However, power consumption for mobile devices and better iGPU performance were listed as bullet points.

As InvaldiError stated, only the enthusiasts were disappointed with Haswell.

 

[Cazalan]

HD 4600 is averaging 40% faster than HD 4000.
Anyone already buying Intel would definitely choose Haswell over Ivy going forward.

 

[8350rocks]

Who will honestly use HD4600??? None of the gaming segment...maybe web surfing senior citizens or other people who see a PC as a solitaire machine. HD 4600 still isn't as good as Trinity graphics...let alone Richland. When Kaveri hits, the gap will be huge again.

The only segment that would use it, would be mobile solutions...laptop, etc. I just don't see any desktop users of a large percentage using it primarily...outside of perhaps a business solution where all you run is MS Office and IE.

EDIT:

You're "proud" of these numbers?:

The i7-4770k cannot even beat the A10 AMD APU in SKYRIM!!!! That's optimized for intel for crying out loud. HD4600 is still subpar.

40% improvement, when you were terrible, just means you're now less terrible.

 

[jaguarskx]

^^

I thought the average performance gain was more like 30%.

In any event for most people who wants to build a PC for games tend to install a discrete graphics card anyway. The iGPU is more important for inexpensive laptops.

 

[BSim500]

I have been saying for sometime that dual core CPUs are going the way of the dodo.

I don't see why given they can hold their ground against many of AMD's quad-cores with literally half the load power consumption. They're awesome chips for non-gamers. Come to think of it, a friend of mine was getting consistent +60fps on Bioshock Infinite, Dishonoured & Skyrim with an i3-3240 + 7790 GFX card on High settings @ 1920x1080.

Intel is only releasing i3 CPUs for mobile platforms with haswell

No they aren't:-

The ARCTIC listing further reveals the 4th Generation Intel Haswell based Core i3 models which consists of five parts posted below:-

Core i3-4240T, Core i3-4240, Core i3-4225, Core i3-4220T, Core i3-4220

http://wccftech.com/arctic-cooling-leaks-complete-intel-haswell-lga1150-cpu-lineup-core-i73980x-confirmed-lga2011/

i3's have always come out late summer / early autumn.

"Those of you that were considering an i3, please reconsider and go to a quad core of some kind".

It's not the cores that count, it's the overall performance (cores + IPC + frequency). An i3 actually performs better than many quad AMD's especially on non-multi-core optimised CPU dependant games (eg, heavily modded Oblivion). And for non-gaming, it's more than sufficient unless you churn out 10hours of video each day.

"Who will honestly use HD4600??? None of the gaming segment...maybe web surfing senior citizens or other people who see a PC as a solitaire machine. HD 4600 still isn't as good as Trinity graphics...let alone Richland. When Kaveri hits, the gap will be huge again."

95% of desktop users interested in gaming (beyond flash games) end up buying a discrete card anyway. Even those on a budget will quadruple their fps by getting a 2nd-hand 5750 on Ebay than arguing over whose iGPU is best : 11fps Intel vs 15fps AMD, on HD resolutions & quality settings that most people actually use...

 

[8350rocks]

@jaguarskx:

I was using the 40% the guy above quoted...I don't know what the actual figure is...but I agree, it's big for laptops. That's about it though.

@BSim500:

The difference is not between unplayable frame rates...the A10-5800K gets 45 FPS in Skyrim @ 720p where the 4770k get a barely playable 30 FPS. The iGPU's in many of these newer SoC's is actually good for 720p gaming in a lot of games.

Also, the i3's only hold their own against AMD quads in older games...where, as you pointed out, they are heavily single threaded. When threading comes into play, i3's fall by the wayside.

I agree, they're sufficient for an office PC, but that would be easily furnished in a BGA format for OEMs like HP and Dell to sell as a bargain office PC for commercial solutions...which is what I was pointing out in the OP. The rumor was i3's will not be available to the commercial public outside of mobile/laptops...then someone later pointed out that there were a few SKUs, but they may all be BGA, which would not be available to a consumer to purchase independently anyway.