Just bought a home.. Looking for opinions on running wired network

[Aunnix]

Hello All,

My girlfriend and I are close to buying a house (everything is in contract and seems to be going well) and I have been thinking of how to run our network.

The house - 970sq ft with a full, unfinished basement. About 5 rooms and a bathroom (2 rooms are very open (living room and kitchen/dining) and then 3 relatively equal sized bedrooms). The basement has a drop ceiling installed, and I plan to finish half of it to build 2 more rooms (an office and workshop), and a small room like the size of a walk in closet or bathroom.

The network - I will most likely be buying a 1000ft spool of wire (as it seems cheaper than buying a 3-4 100ft cables) and I do plan to do CAT6 (future proof, yeah!). I have a few CAT6 and CAT5e 25-50ft cables, but I planned to just run them through walls or something to the devices in the basement as they will be easily accessible 80% of the time (probably above between drop ceiling and floor joists). Wireless setup is a N750 Dual Band Netgear (WNDR4000?) Gigabit router. Attached to the router is an 8 port Gigabit switch, a Wireless B access point (connected by ethernet obviously) and a D-Link Dual Band (Gigabit I think...) Media Bridge (connects a Blu-ray player to my wireless 5ghz signal).

My thoughts are, so far, to have the Netgear router and switch in the office (basement). Then everything will be wired from it... N750(hub) will have a wired connection running to one room over (workshop/basement) to the Wireless-B router as this is the main area of the house I will have B devices running. It will have a wired connection to the 8 port switch which will be in the office to wire in 3-4 PCs. The D-link bridge will connect to the router wirelessly, but I will need to run 4 wires from it for streaming devices (one to the living room, and one to each bedroom (3)... can I run a switch off a bridge to connect more devices to the 5ghz band??).

So, my questions I am facing...
1. Will the N750 router give me good coverage on the first floor with it being in the basement and having the floor joists and drop ceiling between it and a first floor wireless device (ie: the bridge or laptop).

2. If the N750 doesn't give good coverage, I assume I should buy another router to run wired from the N750 to the first floor acting as access point. Do I lose bandwidth plugging the new access point into the switch rather than directly into the N750 router? Also, since the N750 is dual band it is 300mbps for the 2.4ghz band and 450mbps for 5ghz band, so if I use a 300mbps router as the new access point for 2.4ghz devices will I hinder the performance of my Wireless devices or the N750 router? (I've read if I use a 150mpbs device on a 300mpbs router, all devices connected to the router performs as if the router is 150mpbs). Will being Gigabit or not make a difference in performance (since it is only for wireless on the first floor).

3. (the BIG one..) What would be the proper wire type (plenum, riser, stranded, solid core, etc.) for these different setups or does it matter? I don't know if I plan to do wall plates.. I'd like to hide all wires as much as possible, so I do plan to go through the drop ceiling and floor and into walls. But, I like the idea of some slack being able to be pulled out of the wall (like a cable company will do so your TV is not stuck in one spot only in the entire room).

4. What is your opinion on this setup? Haha. Just looking for comments on how optimal/strong this setup will be.

Thanks for all the help.

 

[dbhosttexas]

That seems like an awful lot of routers / access points in such a small area. Mind you, I have no basement, but I do have a 2025 SQ / FT single story slab on grade home (Basements in my area become indoor swimming pools very quickly!). I assume your total floor space would be roughly similar, just split over the main floor, and the basement.

My rig is seen HERE and all of my cable is run through the interior wall cavity up to the attic. I am running 8 cat 6 ethernet cables, pending 8 more (haven't ordered the switch yet), 5 coaxial cables, and 5 cat 5e cables used for telephone through the wall, and penetrating the header through a series of 3 3/4" bores spaced sufficiently far enough apart. This is not a load bearing wall so no biggie...

I looked at N750, N900, and to be blunt, just like AC, there just don't seem to be the client devices out there to take advantage of it. I instead opted for an N600 router (Buffalo AirStation High Power WZR-600DHP). If I hadn't gone for the Buffalo, I would have snagged an Asus RT-N66u. Yes N900, but the router has a great reputation for very strong signal, takes DD-WRT well, plenty of features etc...

My fastest Wireless N devices are N300, and I can get full speed out of them when everyone else in my neighborhood is at work, outside of my house, and down the sidewalk halfway in front of my neighbors house. I would think the coverage for a smaller home through floor would be fine.

Honestly, it all depends on how much work you want to do, and how accessible the footers of your interior walls are from that basement. I would probably put something similar to what I have rigged up, which is in essence a hybrid between a small business network rack, and a home structured wiring project. Everything terminates from the home office. Coax (or phone line, or fiber) comes in from the ISP, and goes to the modem. Modem to router, router to switch, switch to devices directly in the room, OR switch to patch panel, to home runs throughout the house. In my case through the headers coming from the attic. In your case through the footers going up from the basement. Make sure you buy your switch sufficiently large. I sized my switch for "just enough" then my wife added 4 devices that should be wired to her wish list for my project... Now my 16 port needs to be at least 20 ports! What a waste!

On one of those room runs, you will want to make a run somewhere close to power, that you want for your B access point. Preferably as close to structure center as possible, but use your own good judgement for that.

Once set up and mostly configured, use inSSIDer or something similar to determine open channels on both 2.4Ghz, and 5Ghz bands. Set up security using at a minimum WPA personal.

On wireless B, I must admit I am somewhat leery of recommending keeping that online at all... I think B supports WEP only. I could be wrong though... Honestly I have added cheap Wireless N dongles to upgrade WiFi on B and G laptop / netbooks just to keep them online. I have game consoles that have wired connections as well as wireless G, so they got wired to the gigabit backbone, and are working great!

As I understand it, riser grade is for in wall application, if your cable is going to run in a duct at all it MUST be Plenum grade cable. If you will be running close to power for any appreciable length then you will want sheilded cable. Yes shielded, and plenum grade cables cost more, for good reason!

With mine, I run it such that it does NOT parallel power closer than 6", and I try to keep at least a foot space between network and power cables where I can. However if it is just a foot or two running parallel it should be no big deal from my experience.

Just as an FYI, Just plain riser grade solid cable in Category 6 can be had for less than $50.00 for 1000 feet, http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B007WUPDRQ/ref=oh_details_o04_s00_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

If you want a clean, professional install, use keystones with wall plates, and then run jumpers between the wall plates and the devices just like a telephone does... http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B006IKHLJE/ref=oh_details_o00_s00_i01?ie=UTF8&psc=1

http://www.amazon.com/Shaxon-BM303WP1-5B-Single-Keystone-Plates/dp/B006IKH2FC/ref=sr_1_3?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1374167120&sr=1-3&keywords=Keystone+wall+plate

If you do the install correctly, and cleanly not only will you gain a sense of accomplishment getting your own network drops run cleanly, but you will also improve the value of your home. Structured wiring is very much in demand these days.

You mentioned your home office is in the basement, and the basement is also a workshop. IF you are going to be doing dust producing work, like woodworking, or FAR more harmful, metalworking, you MUST close off the office from the workshop area, and utilize dust collection and filtration for that workshop. (PM me if that is what you are doing, I am also a woodworker, and have done a LOT of research into Cyclonic separation, and air quality work, I can point you in the right direction on the cheap!).

 

[Aunnix]

That seems like an awful lot of routers / access points in such a small area. Mind you, I have no basement, but I do have a 2025 SQ / FT single story slab on grade home. I assume your total floor space would be roughly similar, just split over the main floor, and the basement.

Yes, lol, it does seem like a lot of routers. I run the B AP in case I am working on an older laptop, want to run my PS3 wirelessly somewhere, or if a guest has a B/G device they can connect to it without dragging down the rest of my network speeds. The D-link bridge is essentially a 5ghz band wireless adapter for 4 devices, so it doesn't actually act as a router/AP. The extra N300 router that I was saying I may need to buy is only if I need to run another AP on the first floor so that I have a 2.4ghz band N signal in both the basement and upstairs. If the N750 gateway coverage is good upstairs through the floor, I'm set.

My rig is seen HERE and all of my cable is run through the interior wall cavity up to the attic. I am running 8 cat 6 ethernet cables, pending 8 more (haven't ordered the switch yet), 5 coaxial cables, and 5 cat 5e cables used for telephone through the wall, and penetrating the header through a series of 3 3/4" bores spaced sufficiently far enough apart. This is not a load bearing wall so no biggie...

At the moment I have no plans to run wiring for VOIP, phones, etc.. We actually have no phone service, just use cell phones. I'm not sure what the coaxial cables are for though. And, I assume when you say you haven't bought a switch yet, are you referring to just a plain old network switch to allow more device hookups? It's not some switch panel or something that costs hundreds of dollars, correct? lol

I looked at N750, N900, and to be blunt, just like AC, there just don't seem to be the client devices out there to take advantage of it. I instead opted for an N600 router (Buffalo AirStation High Power WZR-600DHP). If I hadn't gone for the Buffalo, I would have snagged an Asus RT-N66u. Yes N900, but the router has a great reputation for very strong signal, takes DD-WRT well, plenty of features etc...

Yeah, I initially was going N600 when I upgraded my entire network (from the B setup to the current N setup), but after I bought an N600 router the N750 refurbished popped up on Newegg for like $30 cheaper so I grabbed the more powerful N750.

My fastest Wireless N devices are N300, and I can get full speed out of them when everyone else in my neighborhood is at work, outside of my house, and down the sidewalk halfway in front of my neighbors house. I would think the coverage for a smaller home through floor would be fine.

Mine are as well. My laptop and my girl's laptop, I have added USB adapters to them so they are not dragging down my speeds. With the current home we are in, my laptop gets about 60-70% signal strength from about 2 rooms away and everything is on a single floor. But, the walls are all concrete/brick in this house. The B AP is just for guests with older devices or older devices that I am working with or using.

Honestly, it all depends on how much work you want to do, and how accessible the footers of your interior walls are from that basement. I would probably put something similar to what I have rigged up, which is in essence a hybrid between a small business network rack, and a home structured wiring project. Everything terminates from the home office. Coax (or phone line, or fiber) comes in from the ISP, and goes to the modem. Modem to router, router to switch, switch to devices directly in the room, OR switch to patch panel, to home runs throughout the house. Make sure you buy your switch sufficiently large. I sized my switch for "just enough" then my wife added 4 devices that should be wired to her wish list for my project... Now my 16 port needs to be at least 20 ports! What a waste!

Well, I have plans to have my Dad help me rewire the electric as well, so I was kind of hoping to run the network cable at the same time. I do plan to try to centralize the all of the networking gear (similar to your rack), but it may not be that fancy lol. I'm basically just planning on a couple shelves on an interior wall that I build when finishing the basement that has the gateway router and one or two switches plugged into. Then from the gateway I will connect the B signal AP via a wire ran through the drop down ceiling "looping" over the wall, or straight through wall, into the workshop. And, the switch(es)... one will wire into the devices between the office and workshop (will run wire into the walls), then one will run hard wire to the walls upstairs. (Well, I will either upgrade the one switch or run 2 if the single 8port is not enough...)

On one of those room runs, you will want to make a run somewhere close to power, that you want for your B access point. Preferably as close to structure center as possible, but use your own good judgement for that.

Thanks for the heads up. I'm assuming you mean close to a power outlet so that I can power the B AP? That is the plan. Of course, after some reading and your comments, I will put the ethernet port/wire at least one or two feet from the power source/outlet.

On wireless B, I must admit I am somewhat leery of recommending keeping that online at all... I think B supports WEP only. I could be wrong though... Honestly I have added cheap Wireless N dongles to upgrade WiFi on B and G laptop / netbooks just to keep them online. I have game consoles that have wired connections as well as wireless G, so they got wired to the gigabit backbone, and are working great!

You are correct... it only does WEP. And, I as well, was leery about running it due to security questions, but when I posted on Tom's last year during my network upgrade, it seems like I was told as an AP it shouldn't be a big problem because it acts as it own's network/router. I would have most likely had issues trying to run it as a extender though. Like I said, the B is mainly for devices guest have or that I am working on and have no adapters available. Otherwise, if it is my personal B device, lol, it will have an adapter except for the PS3.. If in the office with me it will be wired (dumb not to do so) but if I take it upstairs to the big TV then the B wireless is my option (unless I can attach a switch to the bridge to expand its number of ports to allow more than 4 devices on the 5ghz band).

As I understand it, riser grade is for in wall application, if your cable is going to run in a duct at all it MUST be Plenum grade cable. If you will be running close to power for any appreciable length then you will want sheilded cable. Yes shielded, and plenum grade cables cost more, for good reason!

The reason I ask this, is I seem to have different environments that I am (well, can be) running cable through lol. Riser is good for walls, but I hear/read I shouldn't run it in drop ceilings/air handling areas where there is air control/ventilation like attics, etc. (and ducts - I didn't think about them, thanks!). I was hoping one kind for everything though so I'm not buying a little of this and that. And I'm not sure what to do in regards to the stranded or solid core types.

With mine, I run it such that it does NOT parallel power closer than 6", and I try to keep at least a foot space between network and power cables where I can. However if it is just a foot or two running parallel it should be no big deal from my experience.

I've read a little bit about this. I will keep it in mind and do some more research before I start running them. What do you mean by "parelleling power"? Do you just mean power cables/wires (like from the electrical panel of the house)?

If you want a clean, professional install, use keystones with wall plates, and then run jumpers between the wall plates and the devices just like a telephone does... http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B006IKHLJE/ref=oh_details_o00_s00_i01?ie=UTF8&psc=1

http://www.amazon.com/Shaxon-BM303WP1-5B-Single-Keystone-Plates/dp/B006IKH2FC/ref=sr_1_3?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1374167120&sr=1-3&keywords=Keystone+wall+plate

If you do the install correctly, and cleanly not only will you gain a sense of accomplishment getting your own network drops run cleanly, but you will also improve the value of your home. Structured wiring is very much in demand these days.

I do plan to do this correctly and as cleanly as possible. It is basically this reasoning as to why I want to re-run the current electrical wiring. Do the wall plates/jumpers affect my transfer speeds or anything? Ideally, this would be better than just leaving slack in the walls after thinking about it because you can just grab any ethernet cord and go to town... At first, I was thinking the slack in the walls would be nice because that means I get a straight connection from device to terminal/starting point or whatever.

You mentioned your home office is in the basement, and the basement is also a workshop. IF you are going to be doing dust producing work, like woodworking, or FAR more harmful, metalworking, you MUST close off the office from the workshop area, and utilize dust collection and filtration for that workshop. (PM me if that is what you are doing, I am also a woodworker, and have done a LOT of research into Cyclonic separation, and air quality work, I can point you in the right direction on the cheap!).

Good looking out, but no.. nothing crazy like that. Mainly a place to build and repair computers or just tinker with electronics and such. Essentially, it's more of an IT storage area with PC parts/tools and a bench to work at. Simple and small. The most dust flying around will be when I take Air Duster to the inside of a computer case lol.

 

[dbhosttexas]

Yeah, I initially was going N600 when I upgraded my entire network (from the B setup to the current N setup), but after I bought an N600 router the N750 refurbished popped up on Newegg for like $30 cheaper so I grabbed the more powerful N750.

Awesome deal! Worthy of a gloat for sure! I do like those Netgear routers, and to get one at a discounted price, well that is just a nice score!

The reason I ask this, is I seem to have different environments that I am (well, can be) running cable through lol. Riser is good for walls, but I hear/read I shouldn't run it in drop ceilings/air handling areas where there is air control/ventilation like attics, etc. (and ducts - I didn't think about them, thanks!). I was hoping one kind for everything though so I'm not buying a little of this and that. And I'm not sure what to do in regards to the stranded or solid core types.

I might have misunderstood the inspector, but as I understand it, it only has to be plenum grade cable IF it penetrates air handling spaces, such as physically inside of a duct. There are actually people that run network cabling within duct work, so it isn't as odd as it may sound. As long as the cable is not penetrating the conditioned / moved air handling space, you do not need plenum grade cable. He signed off on the regular riser grade cable for my through attic installation without batting an eye.

I do plan to do this correctly and as cleanly as possible. It is basically this reasoning as to why I want to re-run the current electrical wiring. Do the wall plates/jumpers affect my transfer speeds or anything? Ideally, this would be better than just leaving slack in the walls after thinking about it because you can just grab any ethernet cord and go to town... At first, I was thinking the slack in the walls would be nice because that means I get a straight connection from device to terminal/starting point or whatever.

No the wall plate / keystone connection, IF you use properly rated keystones, and install them correctly which is very easy once you know how, do not impact your network performance. They are actually part of the designed standard of the network. So just make sure that if you get category 6 cable, use category 6 rated keystones, and then category 6 rated jack / plugs for the jumpers if you make your own instead of buying them. Yes you CAN simply run the cable with slack and just put a plug end on the cable, that is quite incorrect, and not to either code, or the design standard for category rated cable networks.

It sounds like you are off to a good start then...

If you don't already have a B only router, you might want to grab an N router that you can run in B/G/N on a different channel from your main router, as an AP, or even a cheap refurb G router for that...

I do not use my PS3 on WiFi, but rather ran cable to it and have it cabled via the built in gigabit adapter. MUCH faster. The Wii got a wired ethernet adapter as well.

I must admit to a certain amount of bias though. I admit I strongly prefer wired ethernet over WiFi for performance and reliability. WiFi is great for convenience, but too interference prone...

 

[Aunnix]

Yeah, I initially was going N600 when I upgraded my entire network (from the B setup to the current N setup), but after I bought an N600 router the N750 refurbished popped up on Newegg for like $30 cheaper so I grabbed the more powerful N750.

Awesome deal! Worthy of a gloat for sure! I do like those Netgear routers, and to get one at a discounted price, well that is just a nice score!

Yeah, it has worked out quite nice so far. Especially considering my whole house we are currently renting is nothing but brick, lol.

I might have misunderstood the inspector, but as I understand it, it only has to be plenum grade cable IF it penetrates air handling spaces, such as physically inside of a duct. There are actually people that run network cabling within duct work, so it isn't as odd as it may sound. As long as the cable is not penetrating the conditioned / moved air handling space, you do not need plenum grade cable. He signed off on the regular riser grade cable for my through attic installation without batting an eye.

I have heard of people running wiring through ducts. I just don't think I've really been a fan of that approach, lol. I was wondering about the attic thing because what I read didn't specifically say "attic" but instead just "air handling space where ventilation is being produced" and I know the attic is a large ventilation area for the whole house. Although, it's not a tight space or having air forced through it or anything.. So, that was basically an assumption I was making. It did mention dropdown ceilings though, so that was another thing that made me assume the attic as well because it said (in commercial buildings at least) that dropdowns act as a ventilation system like an attic. You gave me a good idea though.. I will contact the inspector that inspected the house before the buy to see what he says as well.

No the wall plate / keystone connection, IF you use properly rated keystones, and install them correctly which is very easy once you know how, do not impact your network performance. They are actually part of the designed standard of the network. So just make sure that if you get category 6 cable, use category 6 rated keystones, and then category 6 rated jack / plugs for the jumpers if you make your own instead of buying them. Yes you CAN simply run the cable with slack and just put a plug end on the cable, that is quite incorrect, and not to either code, or the design standard for category rated cable networks.

Cool. I will look into this route then.. It will be cleaner anyway.

It sounds like you are off to a good start then...

If you don't already have a B only router, you might want to grab an N router that you can run in B/G/N on a different channel from your main router, as an AP, or even a cheap refurb G router for that...

I do not use my PS3 on WiFi, but rather ran cable to it and have it cabled via the built in gigabit adapter. MUCH faster. The Wii got a wired ethernet adapter as well.

I must admit to a certain amount of bias though. I admit I strongly prefer wired ethernet over WiFi for performance and reliability. WiFi is great for convenience, but too interference prone...

The B AP that I refer to throughout the thread is only a B router/signal. It is from like 2005 or something, lol. A Linksys WRT-B (blah blah... whatever that model is that was replaced directly by their WRT-G, everyone loves because of it's compatibility with the big open source firmware.. WDDRT, or whatever..). So, basically, any G or B devices I run are on this B router. Everything else that is N runs either on the N300 2.4ghz band or the N450 5ghz band (5ghz via the d-link bridge).

The only reason I would need another N router is if the N750 gateway in the basement isn't covering the first floor well enough. Then, (I'm assuming this will work and prevent transfer/data speeds loss) I would get an N300 single band (since my 2.4ghz band is N300) to run to the upstairs and cover it. All of my 5ghz capable devices will be plugged into the D-link bridge (running wirelessly, but 5ghz band doesn't have much traffic to matter and won't interfere with 2.4ghz devices). Which, the PS3 will do when upstairs on the big TV (but I'd like to see if I can expand the ports on it by using a switch to maybe run another 2-3 devices off of it lol - I may test this over the weekend actually..).

And, I do agree. I would prefer wired access for most of my devices throughout the house. Now that we are buying one, I can tear into walls and floors to run a network in the most optimal form. The only things I really want wireless are phones, a few laptops, and guest devices (if needed).