Part 1: Four Cheap 80 PLUS Bronze Power Supplies, Reviewed
Tags:
- Chieftec
- Antec
-
Power Supplies
- Enermax
- Cougar
Last response: in Reviews comments
Anonymous
a
b
)
Power supply
August 27, 2013 9:00:04 PM
Power supply manufacturers condition us to think that efficiency is the one variable you need to pay the most attention to. But we have a suite of tests that more thoroughly taxes PSUs. Can these four inexpensive units under $70 make it through unscathed?
Part 1: Four Cheap 80 PLUS Bronze Power Supplies, Reviewed : Read more
Part 1: Four Cheap 80 PLUS Bronze Power Supplies, Reviewed : Read more
More about : part cheap bronze power supplies reviewed
wolley74
August 27, 2013 9:04:24 PM
computer_nugget2
August 27, 2013 9:20:39 PM
Related resources
- does having a 80 plus bronze,silver,gold and platinum power supplies help reduce electicity bill? - Forum
- CORSAIR CX series CX500 500W ATX12V v2.3 80 PLUS BRONZE Certified Active PFC Power Supply - Forum
- CORSAIR Enthusiast Series TX750 750W 80 PLUS BRONZE Certified Power supply SLI READY? - Forum
- Corsair HX-750 V2 750W Power Supply ATX 80+ Gold Cert vs. Corsair CMPSU-750CXM Modular 750W 80Plus Bronze ATX - Forum
- Would a Cooler Master i700 - 700W Power Supply with 80 PLUS Bronze Certification run a AMD r9 270x? - Forum
computer_nugget2 said:
always judge a power supply by its weight.Some Chinese OEMs put rocks, small concrete blocks, lumps of steel or other stuff like that disguised as a transformer with bits of wire that aren't connected to anything to trick people into believing their heavier PSUs are better.
So weight alone is not a reliable indicator.
Also, at high frequencies and high efficiencies, the size of inductors, capacitors, transformers and heatsinks along with the associated weight shrink. While light weight and high quality may rarely be seen together, they certainly are not mutually exclusive.
Score
8
wolley74 said:
no love for the EVGA 500B? a good chunk of Tom's physical hardware reviews generally are conducted in europe. This goes for a good handful of the gpu tests as well. EVGA rarely ever shows up on review sites because of it(and possibly due to lack of EVGA response to a hardware review pitch)
Score
2
computer_nugget2
August 27, 2013 10:03:45 PM
InvalidError said:
computer_nugget2 said:
always judge a power supply by its weight.Some Chinese OEMs put rocks, small concrete blocks, lumps of steel or other stuff like that disguised as a transformer with bits of wire that aren't connected to anything to trick people into believing their heavier PSUs are better.
So weight alone is not a reliable indicator.
Also, at high frequencies and high efficiencies, the size of inductors, capacitors, transformers and heatsinks along with the associated weight shrink. While light weight and high quality may rarely be seen together, they certainly are not mutually exclusive.
do you have pics to prove this?
Score
-6
envy14tpe said:
This is PART 1. Which means more PSUs to come, so let's hope for no dumb comments asking why not this PSU or this one...They have already listed the PSUs for part 2 and I didn't see a part 3 listed. I wonder where the Corsair CX430 is. Its a 85+ Bronze PSU and is $39.99 on Egg right now. Its one of the best entry level PSUs I have actually used as well and compared to other PSUs at the same price point or higher (within 550W and may or may not be 80+ at all) I have seen less of them come back bad.
Score
4
razor512
August 27, 2013 10:47:33 PM
computer_nugget2 said:
always judge a power supply by its weight.While weight is an important factor, overall weight is 100% useless
for example check out the SIGMA SHARK SP-635
http://www.ocia.net/reviews/sigma635/page2.shtml
it is probably one of the heaviest power supplies you will find (with the exception of some of the 1200 watt ones)
I purchased it a while back and was disappointed at the internals. they used an insanely thick case that made the power supply weigh a lot but the insides were were the result of the owner of the company asking while walking around china, what are the cheapest items we can find on the shenzhen market today.
(at least the power supply can double as a flail or a boat anchor)
Score
5
pyro226
August 27, 2013 10:47:38 PM
sanilmahambre
August 28, 2013 12:13:23 AM
benedict78
August 28, 2013 12:31:56 AM
Could you do a shot of the spikes using a sweep time of 1 us/div, or even less, in the next part please (assuming you get them)? And maybe one that shows a single cycle of the PWM switching (clearly defined on some of these)? It'd be really interesting – I've got some theories about what is causing it, but nothing concrete yet...
Score
1
butremor
August 28, 2013 3:04:05 AM
Who's Who In Power Supplies
Really useful article, let's you look for reviews of PSU real manufacturer if needed.
Really useful article, let's you look for reviews of PSU real manufacturer if needed.
Score
2
How are you loading the minor rails? Loading 12V only will unfairly penalise group regulated designs, which do much better with even a little load on 5V/3V3. Systems still have some load on 5V/3V3, usually things like audio chips on the MB and HDD/SSD electronics.
I'm waiting for the XFX 550W - those go for about $55 (seems to be $62 now), and are supposedly pretty decent.
EDIT: On further reading, you've got a pair of Chroma load testers - so what are the bulbs for?
I'm waiting for the XFX 550W - those go for about $55 (seems to be $62 now), and are supposedly pretty decent.
EDIT: On further reading, you've got a pair of Chroma load testers - so what are the bulbs for?
Score
5
vertexx
August 28, 2013 4:57:43 AM
Why no Corsair? Seems like a pretty big omission - I'm sure there's an explanation, but it would be helpful to understand why? The Corsairs have to be one of the top selling PSUs right now due to their aggressive pricing and general perceived quality. It would be really good to know how these match up, because they are right now my "go-to" brand for budget PSUs.
Score
0
computer_nugget2 said:
do you have pics to prove this? Search for "Fake PFC transformer"
Here's a page with a bunch of examples:
http://www.pcpop.com/doc/0/294/294565_all.shtml
Granted, they are all brands almost nobody knows. Hantol isn't on the list above and seems to be the only other manufacturer who's been caught doing this.
My point simply was: it is known to have happened.
Score
2
antiglobal said:
Resistive load has power factor of 1. DC-DC converters have power factor of less than 1.Actually, DC-DC converters have no power factor in the conventional meaning of the term whatsoever since power factor is used to represent the discrepancy between AC voltage and current which itself is a combination of phase shift and distortion factor intended to represent how much unlike-a-resistor an AC load is.
DC-DC converters are roughly constant-power load and aside from inrush while their input and output caps get charged and load changes, they are practically indistinguishable from resistive load to the upstream AC-DC or DC-DC converter as long as it has enough local decoupling to remove most of the switching noise and ripple.
If you were to calculate the "power factor" of DC-DC converters which basically boils down to determining how much power gets transferred at 0Hz vs any power exchanged at frequencies above that since there is no phase to worry about at 0Hz, you would find out DC-DC converters are indeed very close to 1.
Score
1
Yup.
There is, however, a term called 'total harmonic distortion', which (IIRC) refers to the amount of noise produced by a device.
You can basically treat any load as resistive in DC though - the ripple is barely noticeable (<5%) vs more than twice RMS voltage for AC. And it only occurs on the ripple.
I can probably scrounge some stuff out to test it though, but it's not really necessary.
There is, however, a term called 'total harmonic distortion', which (IIRC) refers to the amount of noise produced by a device.
You can basically treat any load as resistive in DC though - the ripple is barely noticeable (<5%) vs more than twice RMS voltage for AC. And it only occurs on the ripple.
I can probably scrounge some stuff out to test it though, but it's not really necessary.
Score
0
vertexx
August 28, 2013 6:28:09 AM
envy14tpe said:
This is PART 1. Which means more PSUs to come, so let's hope for no dumb comments asking why not this PSU or this one...He already listed the PSU's:
In this piece, we have power supplies from Antec, Chieftec, Cougar, and Enermax. The second part will include Cooler Master, Gigabyte, OCZ, and Seasonic.
So, dumb is dumb I guess.
Score
0
Someone Somewhere said:
There is, however, a term called 'total harmonic distortion', which (IIRC) refers to the amount of noise produced by a device..THD is already accounted for in the PF measurement as the "distortion factor" which accounts for all power transferred at frequencies other than the fundamental.
So on DC which has no phase error, only the distortion factor remains. What you said was implied in what I said.
Score
0
computer_nugget2
August 28, 2013 8:40:17 AM
InvalidError said:
computer_nugget2 said:
do you have pics to prove this? Search for "Fake PFC transformer"
Here's a page with a bunch of examples:
http://www.pcpop.com/doc/0/294/294565_all.shtml
Granted, they are all brands almost nobody knows. Hantol isn't on the list above and seems to be the only other manufacturer who's been caught doing this.
My point simply was: it is known to have happened.
it would help if the thing wasn't in chinese.
Score
0
ddpruitt
August 28, 2013 10:05:44 AM
I think Tom's needs to brush on electronics design a little for these articles. A purely resistive load (like lightbulbs) won't accurately simulate what happens inside a computer with varying inductive and a capacitive loads, especially since they change with time. It also doesn't measure the effects of electrical noise from the various components (CPUs, GPUs, Memory, etc). While the inrush current is interesting I would also like to see the first few moments of startup, something may have a low inrush current but may spike suddenly. I'm also curious on startup voltages, see how stable they are before they settle.
Great start but I think a little tweaking is required. I've always wondered how good these PSU's really are.
Great start but I think a little tweaking is required. I've always wondered how good these PSU's really are.
Score
0
ddpruitt
August 28, 2013 10:09:41 AM
InvalidError said:
Someone Somewhere said:
There is, however, a term called 'total harmonic distortion', which (IIRC) refers to the amount of noise produced by a device..THD is already accounted for in the PF measurement as the "distortion factor" which accounts for all power transferred at frequencies other than the fundamental.
So on DC which has no phase error, only the distortion factor remains. What you said was implied in what I said.
This only applies to a purely resistive load, go outside of resistive and the numbers may be different.
Score
0
ddpruitt said:
InvalidError said:
So on DC which has no phase error, only the distortion factor remains.This only applies to a purely resistive load, go outside of resistive and the numbers may be different.
Huh? It applies to all loads.
The power factor is the percentage of apparent power provided by the source that actually ends up consumed by the load. If the grid has to provide 200VA to power your 100W load due to phase shift and distortion factor (harmonics, crest factor, etc.), the overall power factor is 0.50 or 50%, meaning your 100W load puts twice as much strain on the grid than it ideally should for the power it requires. That's why companies are often billed based on VA rather than Watts - to incite them to keep their power factor in check.
Net power transfer as far as a monotonous source is concerned only occurs at the source's fundamental frequency and for DC sources (PSUs) feeding DC-DC converters, that would be 0Hz. If you know integrals, you can try doing the Fourrier integral or transform for v(t)i(t) yourself for a source of a given frequency and a given current (load) waveform. You will find out that only 0Hz has any net power on a DC source and only 60Hz has any net power on a 60Hz AC source. All other frequencies will average zero (no net transfer) over a common factor number of cycles.
But capacitor and inductor impedance only matters for AC. On DC, capacitors have almost infinite impedance while inductors are almost short-circuits apart for their leakage and wiring losses so unless output voltage or currents change, they are practically invisible to their source.
Since DC has no phase at its fundamental frequency to worry about, power factor simplifies down to DC current / RMS current and due to how little power noise and ripple contribute to RMS unless you have a really awful DC-DC converter, the result will be very close to 1: if you have a 5A load that produces 1A RMS ripple+noise on its input, your power factor would still be 0.98.
With sufficient decoupling to minimize operating noises and ripple at their operating frequency. DC-DC converters operating at constant output power will look almost perfectly resistive between load changes as far as their upstream DC source is concerned.
Score
0
acreoaeneas
August 28, 2013 1:31:22 PM
acreoaeneas
August 28, 2013 1:32:10 PM
Patrick Tobin
August 28, 2013 2:12:19 PM
vertexx
August 28, 2013 2:51:50 PM
computer_nugget2
August 28, 2013 7:34:56 PM
razor512 said:
computer_nugget2 said:
always judge a power supply by its weight.While weight is an important factor, overall weight is 100% useless
for example check out the SIGMA SHARK SP-635
http://www.ocia.net/reviews/sigma635/page2.shtml
it is probably one of the heaviest power supplies you will find (with the exception of some of the 1200 watt ones)
I purchased it a while back and was disappointed at the internals. they used an insanely thick case that made the power supply weigh a lot but the insides were were the result of the owner of the company asking while walking around china, what are the cheapest items we can find on the shenzhen market today.
(at least the power supply can double as a flail or a boat anchor)
thats why, always judge it.
Score
0
razor512 said:
computer_nugget2 said:
always judge a power supply by its weight.While weight is an important factor, overall weight is 100% useless
for example check out the SIGMA SHARK SP-635
http://www.ocia.net/reviews/sigma635/page2.shtml
This is somewhat off topic but, the reviewer had no clue what they were talking about.
They were so concerned about 11.91v on the +12 but that is within 1% WELL within normal limits.
I would be more concerned about the 4.8v (pushing 4% tolerance) on +5v.
Score
0
computer_nugget2
August 28, 2013 8:03:26 PM
smeezekitty said:
razor512 said:
computer_nugget2 said:
always judge a power supply by its weight.While weight is an important factor, overall weight is 100% useless
for example check out the SIGMA SHARK SP-635
http://www.ocia.net/reviews/sigma635/page2.shtml
This is somewhat off topic but, the reviewer had no clue what they were talking about.
They were so concerned about 11.91v on the +12 but that is within 1% WELL within normal limits.
I would be more concerned about the 4.8v (pushing 4% tolerance) on +5v.
yeah, but you know how most computer people are, they demand exact perfection or nothing at all.
Score
0
computer_nugget2
August 28, 2013 8:04:39 PM
mpotran
August 29, 2013 12:46:52 AM
flong777
August 29, 2013 4:05:38 AM
5ocrates
August 29, 2013 4:59:20 AM
Someone Somewhere said:
Even then, some of those caps are from downright shoddy brands. Not so bad on these ones, but part two has several with Samxon. *shudders*Samxon is usually fine for input caps since input caps are subjected to relatively low current ripple.
What usually kills output caps is being grossly under-rated for current ripple: many cheap PSUs use capacitors rated for 700-1200mA on rails rated for over 20A. If you are drawing 10A from one of those rails, the RMS current ripple on the capacitor will likely be over 3A and the PSU is destined for guaranteed short/medium-term failure.
Using knock-off brands might not help but using grossly under-rated parts from one of the top-brands wouldn't save poorly designed PSUs either. Under-rated parts remain under-rated parts regardless of vendor.
Score
0
Quote:
Power supply manufacturers condition us to think that efficiency is the one variable you need to pay the most attention to. No, Id have to disagree ..... reviewers seem to think that efficiency is the one variable we need to pay the most attention to. This statistic is emphasized above all else in every review and the one I pay least attentions to. Voltage stability is the 1st thing I look at...... a review which fails to include such information is one I consider not worth reading.
There's been several reports here on the THG forums where peeps experiencing system crashed under heavy loads had a CX series PSU that fails to maintain the 5% max voltage variation on the 12v rail resulting. This kind of information I think is more important than whether I am going to spend an extra 70 cents a month on electricity.
Score
0
JackNaylorPE said:
Quote:
Power supply manufacturers condition us to think that efficiency is the one variable you need to pay the most attention to. No, Id have to disagree ..... reviewers seem to think that efficiency is the one variable we need to pay the most attention to. This statistic is emphasized above all else in every review and the one I pay least attentions to. Voltage stability is the 1st thing I look at...... a review which fails to include such information is one I consider not worth reading.
There's been several reports here on the THG forums where peeps experiencing system crashed under heavy loads had a CX series PSU that fails to maintain the 5% max voltage variation on the 12v rail resulting. This kind of information I think is more important than whether I am going to spend an extra 70 cents a month on electricity.
80+ Certification means quite a few things that suggest a better supply.
A manufacturer is likely not going to pay to have their supply go through testing if they didn't feel it was decent enough to be worthwhile.
Higher efficiency also suggests higher quality components were used and design we developed to keep efficiency up.
80+ testing also verifies the supply can actually output its labeled power output.
Finally, a more efficient PSU generates less heat which means it should potentially last longer. Electrolytic capacitors hate heat
Score
0
smeezekitty said:
80+ Certification means quite a few things that suggest a better supply.A manufacturer is likely not going to pay to have their supply go through testing if they didn't feel it was decent enough to be worthwhile.
Higher efficiency also suggests higher quality components were used and design we developed to keep efficiency up.
80+ testing also verifies the supply can actually output its labeled power output.
Finally, a more efficient PSU generates less heat which means it should potentially last longer. Electrolytic capacitors hate heat
80+ / 80+ Bronze targets are too easy to meet and while 80+ certification may prove that a PSU is able to meet 80+ efficiency targets, it does not mean much in terms of how well its output regulation and noise will hold through the process nor how long the unit will manage to do so before failing.
You have to step things up to 80+ Silver if you want PSU manufacturers to seriously have to try. This does not guarantee the PSU will retain its 80+ Silver qualification through its lifespan but it does mean that most of what went in it is at least a cut above.
While heat might not be electrolytics' best friend, the main reason electrolytics get hot in the first place is because poorly designed PSUs often use grossly under-rated caps so those caps are destined for imminent failure even if you manage to keep them at room temperature.
Score
0
Yup. So long as it falls within the (very old, very easy to meet) ATX standard (and I'm not sure if they even test that), they don't care about ripple or regulation. And they get worse as it ages.
Cap life also depends on the fan speed - in most cases a PSU will work fine at high temps for a few weeks/months, which is enough to get it through testing. A slow/quiet fan and higher temps makes it more appealing to consumers.
Cap temp also depends on the layout - how much heatsinking there is and how many hot FETs are nearby. If you reduce the heatsinking, the caps might get warmer.
Besides, there's no reason you can't do a Gold PSU with crappy caps. I can't find anything, but I doubt this uses anybody reliable: http://pcpartpicker.com/part/raidmax-power-supply-rx850...
Cap life also depends on the fan speed - in most cases a PSU will work fine at high temps for a few weeks/months, which is enough to get it through testing. A slow/quiet fan and higher temps makes it more appealing to consumers.
Cap temp also depends on the layout - how much heatsinking there is and how many hot FETs are nearby. If you reduce the heatsinking, the caps might get warmer.
Besides, there's no reason you can't do a Gold PSU with crappy caps. I can't find anything, but I doubt this uses anybody reliable: http://pcpartpicker.com/part/raidmax-power-supply-rx850...
Score
0
Someone Somewhere said:
Gold does not necessarily mean more reliable than Bronze, however.I think it is fairly reasonable to expect a 80+ Gold to take longer to degrade to 80+ level. Only way to know for sure though would be to give them a good burn-in at high-power (say 80% of max continuous power for a month at 40-45C) and see how much that beats them up.
Score
0
Well look where it's got the buying public..... thinking they got a great PSU because it says Corsair on it, because it says it's 80+ and THG says it's great and thru all of that there are forum posters complaining it's delivering 11.3 volts on the 12 volt rail.
It's like saying a car is reliable because it has high mpg.
It's like saying a car is reliable because it has high mpg.
Score
0
InvalidError said:
Someone Somewhere said:
Gold does not necessarily mean more reliable than Bronze, however.I think it is fairly reasonable to expect a 80+ Gold to take longer to degrade to 80+ level. Only way to know for sure though would be to give them a good burn-in at high-power (say 80% of max continuous power for a month at 40-45C) and see how much that beats them up.
No, because you're still assuming that efficiency = reliability.
My point is that a 80Plus Gold PSU with bad caps and no protection can still blow up your system if it fails, while even an uncertified one ccould be fine if it's built properly.
Score
0
- 1 / 2
- 2
- Newest
Related resources
- SolvedDoes Corsair ATX Power Modular 750W Supply, 80 PLUS Bronze Certified support Nvidea SLI Forum
- SolvedXFX 550W Core Edition 80+ Bronze PSU vs Corsair Builder Series CX 600 Watt ATX/EPS 80 PLUS Bronze Power Supply Unit Forum
- Corsair Builder Series CX 500 Watt ATX/EPS 80 PLUS Bronze Power Supply Unit Forum
- Help with power supply compatibility the Corsair CX750 Builder Series ATX 80 PLUS Bronze Certified Power Supply Forum
- How good is the Cougar CMX1000 V3 1000W 80 PLUS Bronze Modular Power Supply? Forum
- Power Supply Unit - Thermaltake 750watt smartpower 80plus bronze Forum
- PSU HELP: Seasonic S12II 620W 80PLUS Bronze or Corsair CX600 80Plus Bronze Power Supply Forum
- CORSAIR Builder Series CX430 430W ATX12V v2.3 80 PLUS BRONZE Certified Active PFC Power Supply Forum
- Seasonic 80Plus Power Supply M12II 620 BRONZE Forum
- Coolmax ZP-750B ZP Series Power Supply - 750W, 80 Plus Bronze Forum
- Solvedaerocool strike-x power 600W 80plus bronze Forum
- SolvedWill Corsair TX650 V2 80 Plus Bronze be able to power up this computer? Forum
- SolvedIs PC Power & Cooling Silencer MK III 600W 80 PLUS Bronze sufficient for my build? Forum
- SolvedWill the GTX 650 and the Corsair Builder 430W 80+ Bronze Certified ATX Power Supply fit my PC? Forum
- SILVERSTONE ST50F-ES 500W ATX12V v2.3 80 PLUS Certified Active PFC Power Supply or Super Flower Active PFC230V 500W - SF-500P1 Forum
- More resources
!
It originally rang a bit when the computer was suspended or at random after a few hours of use, but that went away with age.