Attempting a "problem-free" water cooling loop. Too good to be true?

[Aalistor]

So I've done months of research and sticky reading with regards to custom PC water cooling loops. There's a few problems that seem to pop up frequently when water cooling aside from general misuse/poor installation methods:

1. corrosion
2. plasticizer leeching
3. coolant residue throughout loop
4. compression fittings leaking/tube slipping out of them
5. algae
6. chemical incompatibility (glycol solutions + acrylic, etc.)

I've decided to attempt to construct a loop (let's say CPU-only for now) that pays heed to these issues. The text below is in a problem: solution format. From the experts... what are your thoughts on these choices & is a "problem-free" loop too good to be true?

1. corrosion:
Bitspower True Brass Barbs - no plating & brass plays nice with copper + silver

Bitspower acrylic plugs - not metal. no corrosion here (for every location that needs plugged)

Alphacool NexXxos XT45 full copper radiators - keeping metals consistent

EK Supremacy copper waterblock with acrylic top - keeping metals consistent. Acrylic top allows peering into innards to check block's condition without dismantling.


2. plasticizer leeching:
Tygon A-60-G Norprene (1/2" ID 3/4" OD) - no plasticizer, no problem.

3. coolant residue throughout loop:
Distilled water. No additives.

4. compression fittings leaking/tube slipping out of them:
The barbs mentioned above + these worm gear hose clamps.

5. algae:
.999 Silver Killcoil

6. chemical incompatibility (glycol solutions + acrylic, etc.):
There are no chemicals.

Edit: Let's include the XSPC Photon 270 combo as the reservoir & pump. I don't believe this solves any particular problems, but it's a well-rounded & visually appealing pump/reservoir solution.

 

[bolt853]

"Problem free" loops. Hmm, This seems like a good experiment to design your own loop. This might turn out pretty well due to the features that resolve the problems. This could be a great loop. Wish you good luck!

 

[Aalistor]

"Problem free" loops. Hmm, This seems like a good experiment to design your own loop. This might turn out pretty well due to the features that resolve the problems. This could be a great loop. Wish you good luck!

That's if they actually solve the problems. I'm by no means an expert, hence why I'm seeking approval or suggestions from experts. These solutions are just my conclusions to research I've done... but I may have overlooked things.

 

[Aalistor]

I guess I should ask a clear question...

Will these component choices truly eliminate the listed problems? Is an anti-corrosive still needed for loop longevity?

 

[rubix_1011]

If you are not using only distilled water (which is best), you will need an anti-microbial. Kill-coil is one, but also copper is a natural anti-microbial. These 2 aside, you'll likely want to consider some drops to prevent growths. Some watercooling anti-microbials include copper sulfate or other solutions which can chemically react with blocks. I use drops I bought at my local big-box retailer for fish tank growth control and haven't had an issue with any growths for about 2 years.

 

[Aalistor]

If you are not using only distilled water (which is best), you will need an anti-microbial. Kill-coil is one, but also copper is a natural anti-microbial. These 2 aside, you'll likely want to consider some drops to prevent growths. Some watercooling anti-microbials include copper sulfate or other solutions which can chemically react with blocks. I use drops I bought at my local big-box retailer for fish tank growth control and haven't had an issue with any growths for about 2 years.

See above in bold. So, in addition to all the copper components and the kill-coil in my post, I should still add PTNuke (or similar) to my distilled water?

What block materials/loop metals are known to react with CuSO4 solutions?

Are there corrosion concerns with the mentioned components?

Thanks

 

[rubix_1011]

EK has been known to devoid warranties due to water additives when used with nickel plated blocks. Please see the Watercooling sticky (linked in my signature) as it has some sections specifically dedicated to loop filling, additives and corrosion concerns.

http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/277130-29-read-first-watercooling-sticky

 

[Aalistor]

EK has been known to devoid warranties due to water additives when used with nickel plated blocks. Please see the Watercooling sticky (linked in my signature) as it has some sections specifically dedicated to loop filling, additives and corrosion concerns.

http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/277130-29-read-first-watercooling-sticky

That is precisely the sticky that turned me away from nickel-plated anything. Very well-written & informative might I add. However, it doesn't answer the corrosion questions I have. I am aware of the galvanic scale:

Silver + brass + copper + CUSo4 + plain distilled water = no anti-corrosive needed?

 

[rubix_1011]

Yes, those metals are stable enough that you shouldn't need an anti-corrosive, but this all accounts for a best case scenario. I've never really had an issue with any of those metals in a loop, which is what almost everyone running watercooling also runs. (silver killcoil, brass radiators, copper blocks, PT Nuke, etc)

Nickel plating is also 'fine' but be informed about what brands and the methods and quality to which it is manufactured. EK originally had issues, but is said to have corrected it, but many still reported issues. Other vendors didn't see issues.

Avoid Aluminum like the plague.

 

[Aalistor]

Yes, those metals are stable enough that you shouldn't need an anti-corrosive, but this all accounts for a best case scenario. I've never really had an issue with any of those metals in a loop, which is what almost everyone running watercooling also runs. (silver killcoil, brass radiators, copper blocks, PT Nuke, etc)

Nickel plating is also 'fine' but be informed about what brands and the methods and quality to which it is manufactured. EK originally had issues, but is said to have corrected it, but many still reported issues. Other vendors didn't see issues.

Avoid Aluminum like the plague.

Right. It seems every fitting on the face of the earth is nickel/chrome-plated (or painted... just sounds like flake city). These are the only un-plated fittings/barbs I've come across - really trying to keep nickel out.

 

[Deuce65]

1. corrosion: Not really an issue if you pick correct components. Stick to copper\brass and there will be no corrosion.
2. plasticizer leeching: I would actually recommend sticking with clear tubing. My experience is that it is somewhat random which leech and which don't (despite what they advertise as plastezier free); I've gotten batches that were great, then bought the exact same thing later and cloudy in 2 days. With clear though you can actually see right away you have a problem and replace the tubing.
3. Coolant residue: Don't use coolant. Problem solved.
4. compression leaking: Install them correctly. No one ever wants to hear that of course, but whenever I see a compression that leaked, I see a compression that wasn't done correctly.
5. Algae: If you use distilled water from number 3, you won't get algae.
6. Same as 5.

 

[Deuce65]

Yes, those metals are stable enough that you shouldn't need an anti-corrosive, but this all accounts for a best case scenario. I've never really had an issue with any of those metals in a loop, which is what almost everyone running watercooling also runs. (silver killcoil, brass radiators, copper blocks, PT Nuke, etc)

Nickel plating is also 'fine' but be informed about what brands and the methods and quality to which it is manufactured. EK originally had issues, but is said to have corrected it, but many still reported issues. Other vendors didn't see issues.

Avoid Aluminum like the plague.

Right. It seems every fitting on the face of the earth is nickel/chrome-plated (or painted... just sounds like flake city). These are the only un-plated fittings/barbs I've come across - really trying to keep nickel out.

You won't be able to avoid paint completely but why would you? Almost everyone who does this uses the same fitting types and don't have problems, so it stands to reason you won't either.

 

[Aalistor]

Yes, those metals are stable enough that you shouldn't need an anti-corrosive, but this all accounts for a best case scenario. I've never really had an issue with any of those metals in a loop, which is what almost everyone running watercooling also runs. (silver killcoil, brass radiators, copper blocks, PT Nuke, etc)

Nickel plating is also 'fine' but be informed about what brands and the methods and quality to which it is manufactured. EK originally had issues, but is said to have corrected it, but many still reported issues. Other vendors didn't see issues.

Avoid Aluminum like the plague.

Right. It seems every fitting on the face of the earth is nickel/chrome-plated (or painted... just sounds like flake city). These are the only un-plated fittings/barbs I've come across - really trying to keep nickel out.

You won't be able to avoid paint completely but why would you? Almost everyone who does this uses the same fitting types and don't have problems, so it stands to reason you won't either.

Well, that's not entirely true. From a broad engineering perspective, painted components in plumbing is bad news. It will erode over the long haul & adhere to things. I've read a few instances where this has happened. For example: http://forums.swiftech.org/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=2402 and http://www.overclock.net/t/1258443/new-monsoon-fittings-angle/70

I understand some processes are better than others. However, un-plated / un-painted fittings takes the problem out of the equation entirely - no more leaving it up to chance for a bad batch. I believe none of the components I listed have paint or plating on them (aside from external radiator paint).

Also, Norprene tubing is indeed plasticizer-free as it's a rubber compound; it doesn't need plasticizer to attain flexibility, once again taking "bad batch" chance out of the equation. A-60-G is an industrial grade that is extremely resistant to chemicals, UV radiation, and heat per US plastics - distilled water with CuSO4 probably won't have any effect on it at all. At least... that was my logic. I'm no expert.

 

[rubix_1011]

Plasticizer can still leech in clear tubing unless is stated that is not used in the tubing...color doesn't matter, but color does make it more apparent when leeching does occur.

I've used the same barbs for about 10 years....purchased extras, etc, but many are still being used in my loop to this day without any issue. I think you'll be just fine; pick quality parts and you shouldn't have any issue.

You can still get algae and other growth in distilled water (edit: distilled water only) over the course of time. Trust me on this...it can happen.

 

[Aalistor]

Plasticizer can still leech in clear tubing unless is stated that is not used in the tubing...color doesn't matter, but color does make it more apparent when leeching does occur.

I've used the same barbs for about 10 years....purchased extras, etc, but many are still being used in my loop to this day without any issue. I think you'll be just fine; pick quality parts and you shouldn't have any issue.

You can still get algae and other growth in distilled water over the course of time. Trust me on this...it can happen.

Which barbs if you don't mind me asking? And I've been convinced PTNuke should be used alongside the kill-coil.

 

[rubix_1011]

PT Nuke is fine, but I use some simple anti-microbial stuff I got in the pet section of my local retailer. Added about 5 drops of that and haven't had anything grow- distilled water + kill coil as well. Many people use PT Nuke which is good stuff.

Most of my barbs are DangerDen (out of business) and BitsPower.

 

[Aalistor]

PT Nuke is fine, but I use some simple anti-microbial stuff I got in the pet section of my local retailer. Added about 5 drops of that and haven't had anything grow- distilled water + kill coil as well. Many people use PT Nuke which is good stuff.

Most of my barbs are DangerDen (out of business) and BitsPower.

Maybe my local Petsmart will have something then. Are they painted or nickel/chrome coated fittings?

 

[Deuce65]

Plasticizer can still leech in clear tubing unless is stated that is not used in the tubing...color doesn't matter, but color does make it more apparent when leeching does occur.

I've used the same barbs for about 10 years....purchased extras, etc, but many are still being used in my loop to this day without any issue. I think you'll be just fine; pick quality parts and you shouldn't have any issue.

You can still get algae and other growth in distilled water (edit: distilled water only) over the course of time. Trust me on this...it can happen.

Well, the idea behind clear tubing isn't to prevent leaching, but rather so that if it actually happens, you can see it.
TBH I have never heard of paint peeling, never had it happen; keep in mind most of us are changing things out every year or two. We aren't running things for 50 years straight like you would have in normal plumbing situations. But I guess the safest way to be 100 percent sure is as you said, to not use paint at all.
Distilled water though should have no algea in it. I hesitate to say it is completely impossible, but copper in itself is poisonous, so even if it were possible to get algea, that would kill it. Same as a silver plug\killcoil.
I seem to remember a test martinsliquidlab did some years ago, where he demonstrated that most of us are actually over cautious. He tested a number of things, but relevent here is he ran a loop for something like 2 years straight with plain old tap water and it ran fine, no algea, no corrosion, etc.

 

[Aalistor]

Plasticizer can still leech in clear tubing unless is stated that is not used in the tubing...color doesn't matter, but color does make it more apparent when leeching does occur.

I've used the same barbs for about 10 years....purchased extras, etc, but many are still being used in my loop to this day without any issue. I think you'll be just fine; pick quality parts and you shouldn't have any issue.

You can still get algae and other growth in distilled water (edit: distilled water only) over the course of time. Trust me on this...it can happen.

Well, the idea behind clear tubing isn't to prevent leaching, but rather so that if it actually happens, you can see it.
TBH I have never heard of paint peeling, never had it happen; keep in mind most of us are changing things out every year or two. We aren't running things for 50 years straight like you would have in normal plumbing situations. But I guess the safest way to be 100 percent sure is as you said, to not use paint at all.
Distilled water though should have no algea in it. I hesitate to say it is completely impossible, but copper in itself is poisonous, so even if it were possible to get algea, that would kill it. Same as a silver plug\killcoil.
I seem to remember a test martinsliquidlab did some years ago, where he demonstrated that most of us are actually over cautious. He tested a number of things, but relevent here is he ran a loop for something like 2 years straight with plain old tap water and it ran fine, no algea, no corrosion, etc.

Right here. Blew me away: http://martinsliquidlab.org/2012/01/02/distilled-water-is-the-king-of-water-cooling/2/

But yes my ultimate goal is to not have to switch out stuff every year or two. Acrylic top water blocks to inspect what's going on inside. Max maintenance I want is draining/re-filling/leak testing.

 

[rubix_1011]

I haven't drained my loop since I rebuilt it...that's been easily 2+ years. I believe it was closer 3+ years before that.

 

[Aalistor]

I'm feeling more and more comfortable building a loop now. Figure I'll start with CPU only & do GPU's when and if I get a 2nd GTX 780.

 

[rubix_1011]

It's a lot of info to understand but simple once you figure it all out. I think the biggest issue with folks starting their first loop is the amount of information and data out there as well as the selection of gear. Once you know what does what and how, then it becomes easier to determine what you need for your loop, what you don't need and how you should set it all up.