No Send option on Received shows...

Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.replaytv (More info?)

I am trying to fulfill a poopli.com request for a show on my 5080. It is a
movie that I received from another poopli user. By default it was saved
under 'Received' category. When I highlight it and push select button on
remote, there is no 'Send' option as there is on shows under the other
categories. Why is that?

How can I send those shows to other users if there is no 'Send' command?

TB
17 answers Last reply
More about send option received shows
  1. Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.replaytv (More info?)

    On Mon, 1 Nov 2004 19:39:02 -0600, "T.B."
    <balfour@NOSPAMgrandecom.net> wrote:

    >I am trying to fulfill a poopli.com request for a show on my 5080. It is a
    >movie that I received from another poopli user. By default it was saved
    >under 'Received' category. When I highlight it and push select button on
    >remote, there is no 'Send' option as there is on shows under the other
    >categories. Why is that?
    >
    >How can I send those shows to other users if there is no 'Send' command?
    >
    >TB
    >

    That's one of those **** limitations of the Replay. It won't let you
    send shows you received.

    A form of copyright "protection". More (business-controlled)
    government interferance.

    You could re-record it if you can figure out how. Maybe by
    transferring it to another Replay, or saving to VCR or DVD and
    manually recording it from that.

    --
    55 days until the winter solstice celebration

    Mark Lloyd
    http://notstupid.laughingsquid.com
  2. Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.replaytv (More info?)

    what about renaming it and trying to save it somewhere else?


    "Mark Lloyd" <mlloyd@5xxxmail.com5xxx> wrote in message
    news:absdo0d4esau9qbk30m39uhvm4vkbeppuk@4ax.com...
    > On Mon, 1 Nov 2004 19:39:02 -0600, "T.B."
    > <balfour@NOSPAMgrandecom.net> wrote:
    >
    > >I am trying to fulfill a poopli.com request for a show on my 5080. It is
    a
    > >movie that I received from another poopli user. By default it was saved
    > >under 'Received' category. When I highlight it and push select button on
    > >remote, there is no 'Send' option as there is on shows under the other
    > >categories. Why is that?
    > >
    > >How can I send those shows to other users if there is no 'Send' command?
    > >
    > >TB
    > >
    >
    > That's one of those **** limitations of the Replay. It won't let you
    > send shows you received.
    >
    > A form of copyright "protection". More (business-controlled)
    > government interferance.
    >
    > You could re-record it if you can figure out how. Maybe by
    > transferring it to another Replay, or saving to VCR or DVD and
    > manually recording it from that.
    >
    > --
    > 55 days until the winter solstice celebration
    >
    > Mark Lloyd
    > http://notstupid.laughingsquid.com
  3. Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.replaytv (More info?)

    On Mon, 1 Nov 2004 22:20:39 -0600, "T.B."
    <balfour@NOSPAMgrandecom.net> wrote:

    >what about renaming it and trying to save it somewhere else?
    >

    You can always try it. That would be faster and easier than asking.

    Anyway, I think I tried that once. You don't get the option.

    >
    >"Mark Lloyd" <mlloyd@5xxxmail.com5xxx> wrote in message
    >news:absdo0d4esau9qbk30m39uhvm4vkbeppuk@4ax.com...
    >> On Mon, 1 Nov 2004 19:39:02 -0600, "T.B."
    >> <balfour@NOSPAMgrandecom.net> wrote:
    >>
    >> >I am trying to fulfill a poopli.com request for a show on my 5080. It is
    >a
    >> >movie that I received from another poopli user. By default it was saved
    >> >under 'Received' category. When I highlight it and push select button on
    >> >remote, there is no 'Send' option as there is on shows under the other
    >> >categories. Why is that?
    >> >
    >> >How can I send those shows to other users if there is no 'Send' command?
    >> >
    >> >TB
    >> >
    >>
    >> That's one of those **** limitations of the Replay. It won't let you
    >> send shows you received.
    >>
    >> A form of copyright "protection". More (business-controlled)
    >> government interferance.
    >>
    >> You could re-record it if you can figure out how. Maybe by
    >> transferring it to another Replay, or saving to VCR or DVD and
    >> manually recording it from that.
    >>
    >> --
    >> 55 days until the winter solstice celebration
    >>
    >> Mark Lloyd
    >> http://notstupid.laughingsquid.com
    >

    --
    55 days until the winter solstice celebration

    Mark Lloyd
    http://notstupid.laughingsquid.com
  4. Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.replaytv (More info?)

    Mark Lloyd wrote:

    > That's one of those **** limitations of the Replay. It won't let you
    > send shows you received.
    >
    > A form of copyright "protection". More (business-controlled)
    > government interferance.

    That sounds like SCMS (Serial Copy Management System) used on a lot of
    audio gear (Including CD recorders, not the one in your computer but
    stand alone units, and Mini-Disc) the rule is that if a "Master" is
    recorded "Analog" (All Replay recordings are originally analog input
    recordings, even though the file is a digital record) you may copy it

    One generation... But if the "Source" is "Digital" (Example, a copy of a
    show from another Replay you may not.

    I can not help you with video products,,,, but in the world of audio I
    routinely ignore SCMS (I do a LOT of audio work, all legitimate I might
    add, no jolly roger stuff)
  5. Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.replaytv (More info?)

    T.B. wrote:
    > what about renaming it and trying to save it somewhere else?
    >
    >
    You can rename it, but you can't send it.
  6. Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.replaytv (More info?)

    John in Detroit wrote:

    > Mark Lloyd wrote:
    >
    >> That's one of those **** limitations of the Replay. It won't let you
    >> send shows you received.
    >>
    >> A form of copyright "protection". More (business-controlled)
    >> government interferance.
    >
    >
    > That sounds like SCMS (Serial Copy Management System) used on a lot of
    > audio gear (Including CD recorders, not the one in your computer but
    > stand alone units, and Mini-Disc) the rule is that if a "Master" is
    > recorded "Analog" (All Replay recordings are originally analog input
    > recordings, even though the file is a digital record) you may copy it

    It has nothing to do with the files. On a Replay the software prevents
    sending a sent show and it prevents you from sending to more than 15
    people. This stops the Replay from being part of a pirate distribution
    network. There IS a provision in the software to prevent recording a
    show if the vendor turns on a PPV flag AND Replay decides to turn it on.
  7. Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.replaytv (More info?)

    is there any known way around this 'feature' of RTV?

    TB

    "Tony D" <Tony_D@nospam.com> wrote in message news:4187c3df$1_2@127.0.0.1...
    > John in Detroit wrote:
    >
    > > Mark Lloyd wrote:
    > >
    > >> That's one of those **** limitations of the Replay. It won't let you
    > >> send shows you received.
    > >>
    > >> A form of copyright "protection". More (business-controlled)
    > >> government interferance.
    > >
    > >
    > > That sounds like SCMS (Serial Copy Management System) used on a lot of
    > > audio gear (Including CD recorders, not the one in your computer but
    > > stand alone units, and Mini-Disc) the rule is that if a "Master" is
    > > recorded "Analog" (All Replay recordings are originally analog input
    > > recordings, even though the file is a digital record) you may copy it
    >
    > It has nothing to do with the files. On a Replay the software prevents
    > sending a sent show and it prevents you from sending to more than 15
    > people. This stops the Replay from being part of a pirate distribution
    > network. There IS a provision in the software to prevent recording a
    > show if the vendor turns on a PPV flag AND Replay decides to turn it on.
    >
  8. Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.replaytv (More info?)

    On Tue, 02 Nov 2004 12:38:36 -0500, Tony D <Tony_D@nospam.com> wrote:

    >John in Detroit wrote:
    >
    >> Mark Lloyd wrote:
    >>
    >>> That's one of those **** limitations of the Replay. It won't let you
    >>> send shows you received.
    >>>
    >>> A form of copyright "protection". More (business-controlled)
    >>> government interferance.
    >>
    >>
    >> That sounds like SCMS (Serial Copy Management System) used on a lot of
    >> audio gear (Including CD recorders, not the one in your computer but
    >> stand alone units, and Mini-Disc) the rule is that if a "Master" is
    >> recorded "Analog" (All Replay recordings are originally analog input
    >> recordings, even though the file is a digital record) you may copy it
    >
    >It has nothing to do with the files. On a Replay the software prevents
    >sending a sent show and it prevents you from sending to more than 15
    >people.

    Another undocumented unfeature.

    >This stops the Replay from being part of a pirate distribution
    >network.

    And interferes with legitimate users. That's how I found out about
    that 15 time limit (when sending a test clip).

    >There IS a provision in the software to prevent recording a
    >show if the vendor turns on a PPV flag AND Replay decides to turn it on.

    I heard that TiVo has started using that unfeature (and even worse,
    deleting the files after a few days). Another reason to prefer the
    Replay,

    --
    55 days until the winter solstice celebration

    Mark Lloyd
    http://notstupid.laughingsquid.com
  9. Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.replaytv (More info?)

    T.B. wrote:

    > is there any known way around this 'feature' of RTV?
    >
    Yeah, move the files to PC and ftp them to the universe OR burn them to DVD.
  10. Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.replaytv (More info?)

    Mark Lloyd <mlloyd@5xxxmail.com5xxx> shaped the electrons to say:
    >>It has nothing to do with the files. On a Replay the software prevents
    >>sending a sent show and it prevents you from sending to more than 15
    >>people.
    >Another undocumented unfeature.

    I know it is documented, I've known RTV has had this for years. I
    read it in one of the docs I downloaded.

    >>There IS a provision in the software to prevent recording a
    >>show if the vendor turns on a PPV flag AND Replay decides to turn it on.
    >I heard that TiVo has started using that unfeature (and even worse,
    >deleting the files after a few days). Another reason to prefer the
    >Replay,

    I think you missed the fact that DNNA/RTV will be incorporating the
    same MacroVision enhancements that TiVo is, resulting in the same
    restrictions on content. In fact, DNNA caved in first.

    ---

    CONSUMER ELECTRONICS DAILY THURSDAY, SEPTEMBER 2, 2004

    Macrovision Brokers Deal on PVR Storage Limits With TiVo, ReplayTV

    Macrovision has reached agreements with ReplayTV and TiVo that would
    place limits on how much content may be recorded and stored on
    high-capacity PVRs, Carol Flaherty, senior vp in Macrovision's
    Technology Group told a day-long piracy workshop in L.A. sponsored by
    IRMA. In negotiations with the major studios brokered by Macrovision,
    ReplayTV and TiVo have agreed to impose changes in the "trigger bits"
    built into Macrovision analog copy protection in a PVR to activate one
    of 4 newcopy-control "settings" to be determined by the content owner,
    Flaherty said. She billed the agreements as a winwin for the content
    industry and consumers; the studios were concerned that with
    hard-drive capacities of 400 hours or more, consumers would amass vast
    libraries of content that could be redistributed without
    authorization, and they originally sought strict restrictions that
    would have allowed little or no copying, she said. For consumers, she
    said, the agreements also represent a victory because they would
    assure a steadier availability of content and services for years to
    come. She said the agreement with ReplayTV parent D&M Holdings was
    reached last year, while the TiVo pact was finalized only last
    week. The copy-control settings negotiated range from a provision that
    would permit consumers to "copy freely," to stipulations they be
    confined to 90 min. worth of storage before the PVR automatically
    would be triggered to write over the material, Flaherty said. A 3rd
    setting would let a consumer view content within a 24-hour period
    during storage limited to 7 days, while a 4th would allow unlimited
    viewing during the 7 days. The PVR makers and the brands they OEM for
    will install the settings through a software change on new machines,
    Flaherty said. There's a provision in the future for making the
    changes in legacy machines through software downloads from the
    Internet, she said. Flaherty told Consumer Electronics Daily that
    future chip implementations in development would allow many more
    settings. She again billed this as being in the best interests of
    Hollywood and advocates offair use. She said the agreements apply only
    to NTSC, not PAL PVRs. The Macrovision changes were disclosed at the
    IRMA session in L.A., where content providers and digital rights
    management (DRM) experts announced increased efforts to reign in
    "casual consumer piracy," including through PVR storage. On a "Copy
    Stoppers" panel, Flaherty said: "We cannot have units with 40 hours
    capacity anymore. People cannot be allowed to create electronic
    libraries because if they can get it for free they won't pay for
    it. The landscape on casual consumer piracy has changed over the last
    2 years. In order to stop it we've got to close the holes available to
    consumers in their home equipment, develop multiple layers of
    protection and give consumers a reason to buy instead of steal."
    Later, Rich LaMagna, dir.-digital investigations for Microsoft, said:
    "Theft and leakage out of the supply chain is our greatest threat."
    Current efforts to reduce DVD piracy focus on areas such as
    replication plants, where stampers have gone missing, and recyclers,
    which sometimes resell "scrap" products -- overruns and other surplus
    product -- which are then sold on the black market. Of great concern
    to the software industry is the theft of certificates of authenticity,
    LaMagna said: "Those are just like currency. I have spoken before
    Congress twice to try and get legislation passed that will make it
    illegal to sell any part of a software package as a stand-alone
    product and I think we're going to get it passed." -- Paul Gluckman,
    Valerie Milano

    ---

    -MZ, RHCE #806199299900541, ex-CISSP #3762
    --
    <URL:mailto:megazoneatmegazone.org> Gweep, Discordian, Author, Engineer, me.
    "A little nonsense now and then, is relished by the wisest men" 508-755-4098
    <URL:http://www.megazone.org/> <URL:http://www.eyrie-productions.com/> Eris
  11. Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.replaytv (More info?)

    On Wed, 3 Nov 2004 01:55:27 +0000 (UTC), newsREMOVE@THISmegazone.org
    (MegaZone) wrote:

    >Mark Lloyd <mlloyd@5xxxmail.com5xxx> shaped the electrons to say:

    Please try to get the attributions right. I did not say the following.

    >>>It has nothing to do with the files. On a Replay the software prevents
    >>>sending a sent show and it prevents you from sending to more than 15
    >>>people.
    >>Another undocumented unfeature.
    >
    >I know it is documented, I've known RTV has had this for years. I
    >read it in one of the docs I downloaded.
    >
    >>>There IS a provision in the software to prevent recording a
    >>>show if the vendor turns on a PPV flag AND Replay decides to turn it on.
    >>I heard that TiVo has started using that unfeature (and even worse,
    >>deleting the files after a few days). Another reason to prefer the
    >>Replay,
    >
    >I think you missed the fact that DNNA/RTV will be incorporating the
    >same MacroVision enhancements that TiVo is, resulting in the same
    >restrictions on content. In fact, DNNA caved in first.
    >
    >---
    >
    >CONSUMER ELECTRONICS DAILY THURSDAY, SEPTEMBER 2, 2004
    >
    >Macrovision Brokers Deal on PVR Storage Limits With TiVo, ReplayTV
    >
    >Macrovision has reached agreements with ReplayTV and TiVo that would
    >place limits on how much content may be recorded and stored on
    >high-capacity PVRs, Carol Flaherty, senior vp in Macrovision's
    >Technology Group told a day-long piracy workshop in L.A. sponsored by
    >IRMA. In negotiations with the major studios brokered by Macrovision,
    >ReplayTV and TiVo have agreed to impose changes in the "trigger bits"
    >built into Macrovision analog copy protection in a PVR to activate one
    >of 4 newcopy-control "settings" to be determined by the content owner,
    >Flaherty said. She billed the agreements as a winwin for the content
    >industry and consumers; the studios were concerned that with
    >hard-drive capacities of 400 hours or more, consumers would amass vast
    >libraries of content that could be redistributed without
    >authorization, and they originally sought strict restrictions that
    >would have allowed little or no copying, she said. For consumers, she
    >said, the agreements also represent a victory because they would
    >assure a steadier availability of content and services for years to
    >come. She said the agreement with ReplayTV parent D&M Holdings was
    >reached last year, while the TiVo pact was finalized only last
    >week. The copy-control settings negotiated range from a provision that
    >would permit consumers to "copy freely," to stipulations they be
    >confined to 90 min. worth of storage before the PVR automatically
    >would be triggered to write over the material, Flaherty said. A 3rd
    >setting would let a consumer view content within a 24-hour period
    >during storage limited to 7 days, while a 4th would allow unlimited
    >viewing during the 7 days. The PVR makers and the brands they OEM for
    >will install the settings through a software change on new machines,
    >Flaherty said. There's a provision in the future for making the
    >changes in legacy machines through software downloads from the
    >Internet, she said. Flaherty told Consumer Electronics Daily that
    >future chip implementations in development would allow many more
    >settings. She again billed this as being in the best interests of
    >Hollywood and advocates offair use. She said the agreements apply only
    >to NTSC, not PAL PVRs. The Macrovision changes were disclosed at the
    >IRMA session in L.A., where content providers and digital rights
    >management (DRM) experts announced increased efforts to reign in
    >"casual consumer piracy," including through PVR storage. On a "Copy
    >Stoppers" panel, Flaherty said: "We cannot have units with 40 hours
    >capacity anymore. People cannot be allowed to create electronic
    >libraries because if they can get it for free they won't pay for
    >it. The landscape on casual consumer piracy has changed over the last
    >2 years. In order to stop it we've got to close the holes available to
    >consumers in their home equipment, develop multiple layers of
    >protection and give consumers a reason to buy instead of steal."
    >Later, Rich LaMagna, dir.-digital investigations for Microsoft, said:
    >"Theft and leakage out of the supply chain is our greatest threat."
    >Current efforts to reduce DVD piracy focus on areas such as
    >replication plants, where stampers have gone missing, and recyclers,
    >which sometimes resell "scrap" products -- overruns and other surplus
    >product -- which are then sold on the black market. Of great concern
    >to the software industry is the theft of certificates of authenticity,
    >LaMagna said: "Those are just like currency. I have spoken before
    >Congress twice to try and get legislation passed that will make it
    >illegal to sell any part of a software package as a stand-alone
    >product and I think we're going to get it passed." -- Paul Gluckman,
    >Valerie Milano
    >
    >---
    >
    >-MZ, RHCE #806199299900541, ex-CISSP #3762

    --
    55 days until the winter solstice celebration

    Mark Lloyd
    http://notstupid.laughingsquid.com
  12. Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.replaytv (More info?)

    Tony D wrote:

    > T.B. wrote:
    >
    >> is there any known way around this 'feature' of RTV?
    >>
    > Yeah, move the files to PC and ftp them to the universe OR burn them to
    > DVD.
    >

    Can you suggest a place to which we can FTP them... I'm still having
    issues with my LINUX machine and I think I put the Replay in the DMZ on
    the router (it only lets one computer dmz)

    You know....... I could put up the FTP server on the linux box though,
    I'll bet I could reach that via both lan and internet If I stuck it in DMZ
  13. Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.replaytv (More info?)

    On Fri, 05 Nov 2004 11:34:15 GMT, John in Detroit
    <Blanked@sbcglobal.net> wrote:

    >Tony D wrote:
    >
    >> T.B. wrote:
    >>
    >>> is there any known way around this 'feature' of RTV?
    >>>
    >> Yeah, move the files to PC and ftp them to the universe OR burn them to
    >> DVD.
    >>
    >
    >Can you suggest a place to which we can FTP them... I'm still having
    >issues with my LINUX machine and I think I put the Replay in the DMZ on
    >the router (it only lets one computer dmz)
    >
    >You know....... I could put up the FTP server on the linux box though,
    >I'll bet I could reach that via both lan and internet If I stuck it in DMZ

    It would be better not to use DMZ. If possible, just forward the
    appropriate ports (ports 20-21 and the passive mode range specified by
    the FTP server). Either way, you'll need to enter your public IP into
    the FTP program to get passive mode to work.

    --
    55 days until the winter solstice celebration

    Mark Lloyd
    has a Replay 5xxx
    http://notstupid.laughingsquid.com

    "It is a curious thing that every creed promises a
    paradise which will be absolutely uninhabitable for
    anyone of civilized taste." -- Evelyn Waugh
  14. Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.replaytv (More info?)

    John in Detroit wrote:

    >> Yeah, move the files to PC and ftp them to the universe OR burn them
    >> to DVD.

    Gentlemen, I have not yet received my replayTV unit, but I am intending
    to move them from the replay unit to my PC, then to DVD.
    Would someone who is knowledgeable in this process please describe the
    steps required??

    Thanks very much. A confused old fart in Texas.

    P.S. Also suggestions on correct software would be good also. :^)
  15. Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.replaytv (More info?)

    On Fri, 05 Nov 2004 15:28:56 GMT, Jeff O'Malley
    <jomalley4@houston.rr.com> wrote:

    >John in Detroit wrote:
    >
    >>> Yeah, move the files to PC and ftp them to the universe OR burn them
    >>> to DVD.
    >
    >Gentlemen, I have not yet received my replayTV unit, but I am intending
    >to move them from the replay unit to my PC, then to DVD.
    > Would someone who is knowledgeable in this process please describe the
    >steps required??
    >
    > Thanks very much. A confused old fart in Texas.
    >
    >P.S. Also suggestions on correct software would be good also. :^)

    I do a lot of that.

    1. Transfer files to computer using DVArchive
    (http://www.dvarchive.org/). The Replay & DVA can be set up to
    automatically transfer shows. I just look in a certain directory on my
    main computer every day, and often find shows I want.

    2. (optional) edit videos with MPEG2VCR
    (http://www.womble.com/vcr-text.htm).

    3. Create/burn DVD with DVD authoring software. I use Ulead Movie
    Factory (http://www.ulead.com/dmf/runme.htm), although there are
    others, like the one that comes with Nero
    (http://www.nero.com/us/27515.html).

    Of course, you still need the physical DVD drive (or you can create
    video CDs which hold over an hour of video).

    --
    55 days until the winter solstice celebration

    Mark Lloyd
    has a Replay 5xxx
    http://notstupid.laughingsquid.com

    "It is a curious thing that every creed promises a
    paradise which will be absolutely uninhabitable for
    anyone of civilized taste." -- Evelyn Waugh
  16. Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.replaytv (More info?)

    Check the article on the Jim's Tips website at:

    http://g04.com/html/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=2

    It's a step-by-step guide that I have found works well. One change to
    what Jim suggests -- I have not had a problem with keeping the audio
    synchronized with the video. In shows with commercials, I simply cut
    the commercials and save the file and it seems to work fine. This
    approach is a little faster than Jim's cut-and-paste method.

    Jeff Stenger


    Jeff O'Malley <jomalley4@houston.rr.com> wrote in message news:<Y_Mid.26430$IE1.15217@fe1.texas.rr.com>...
    > John in Detroit wrote:
    >
    > >> Yeah, move the files to PC and ftp them to the universe OR burn them
    > >> to DVD.
    >
    > Gentlemen, I have not yet received my replayTV unit, but I am intending
    > to move them from the replay unit to my PC, then to DVD.
    > Would someone who is knowledgeable in this process please describe the
    > steps required??
    >
    > Thanks very much. A confused old fart in Texas.
    >
    > P.S. Also suggestions on correct software would be good also. :^)
  17. Archived from groups: alt.video.ptv.replaytv (More info?)

    On 12 Nov 2004 09:13:43 -0800, jeff@dabble.com (Jeff Stenger) wrote:

    >Check the article on the Jim's Tips website at:
    >
    >http://g04.com/html/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=2
    >
    >It's a step-by-step guide that I have found works well. One change to
    >what Jim suggests -- I have not had a problem with keeping the audio
    >synchronized with the video.

    I haven't had that problem fof awhile. Possibly there was a Replay
    update that fixed it. I wish they'd fix the dynamic IP bug.

    > In shows with commercials, I simply cut
    >the commercials and save the file and it seems to work fine. This
    >approach is a little faster than Jim's cut-and-paste method.
    >

    That's what I've always done.

    >Jeff Stenger
    >
    >
    >Jeff O'Malley <jomalley4@houston.rr.com> wrote in message news:<Y_Mid.26430$IE1.15217@fe1.texas.rr.com>...
    >> John in Detroit wrote:
    >>
    >> >> Yeah, move the files to PC and ftp them to the universe OR burn them
    >> >> to DVD.
    >>
    >> Gentlemen, I have not yet received my replayTV unit, but I am intending
    >> to move them from the replay unit to my PC, then to DVD.
    >> Would someone who is knowledgeable in this process please describe the
    >> steps required??
    >>
    >> Thanks very much. A confused old fart in Texas.
    >>
    >> P.S. Also suggestions on correct software would be good also. :^)

    --
    43 days until the winter solstice celebration

    Mark Lloyd
    has a Replay 5xxx
    http://go.to/notstupid
    http://notstupid.laughingsquid.com

    "It is a curious thing that every creed promises a
    paradise which will be absolutely uninhabitable for
    anyone of civilized taste." -- Evelyn Waugh
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