The Ultimate Hardware Guide [Last Update: 4-14-06] - Page 5 - CPUs

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Major update, check it out, see if anything is wrong or you wish to add your 2 cents to the fray, thanks.

~~Mad Mod Mike, pimpin' the world 1 rig at a time

Reply to MadModMike

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I think I just bumped this........... :twisted:

~~Mad Mod Mike, pimpin' the world 1 rig at a time

Reply to MadModMike

Quote :

I did at FIRST agree with this thread as it was presented in a non-biased manner. It has moved far from that after many updates to the first post.

Re-reading the first post after the last few updates has changed my opinion of this thread. It is now a very biased piece that needs review by the originator if he TRULY intends to shed light on his topic. The references on AM2 and Conroe are nothing more than speculation on his part.

Mike if you want credibility in any forum then providing facts that support your statements greatly helps. When you first released this I actually agreed with your content (but then again who am I). Problem is it has quickly turned into a platform for you to PREACH AMD.

I guess what I am saying is that if your facts remain unbiased, when you suggest AMD because of the X reasons then it would make a whole lot of sense. It is then based on factual information and not a rant.

Just so you know I agree, that in the current gen of procs the X2/Opterons can not be beaten. But the future remains to be seen and maybe the Conroe will make strides maybe not. Maybe AM2 will make strides as well. Maybe not.

Very well put... and warranted.

Reply to RichPLS

Quote :

I did at FIRST agree with this thread as it was presented in a non-biased manner. It has moved far from that after many updates to the first post.

Re-reading the first post after the last few updates has changed my opinion of this thread. It is now a very biased piece that needs review by the originator if he TRULY intends to shed light on his topic. The references on AM2 and Conroe are nothing more than speculation on his part.

Mike if you want credibility in any forum then providing facts that support your statements greatly helps. When you first released this I actually agreed with your content (but then again who am I). Problem is it has quickly turned into a platform for you to PREACH AMD.

I guess what I am saying is that if your facts remain unbiased, when you suggest AMD because of the X reasons then it would make a whole lot of sense. It is then based on factual information and not a rant.

Just so you know I agree, that in the current gen of procs the X2/Opterons can not be beaten. But the future remains to be seen and maybe the Conroe will make strides maybe not. Maybe AM2 will make strides as well. Maybe not.

Very well put... and warranted.

eh? As I said, show me where I was biased, because until I see it, there is no "warrantation" and that wasn't "well put". I saw another person either a) jealous (not sure why) or b) mad at me because he doesn't agree with what I say. I challenge you and every single Forum goer to find my BIASism in there, because I truly cannot find it.

~~Mad Mod Mike, pimpin' the world 1 rig at a time

Reply to MadModMike

Quote :

VI. Conroe Processors [Sockets: 775]:

The Next Generation for Desktop CPU's from Intel is the "Conroe". "Conroe" will sport DDR2, and FSB's ranging from 800MHz, 1066MHz, and 1333MHz for the Extreme Edition. Clock Speeds from 2.4GHz up to 3.33GHz in the Extreme Edition (Provided Intel can make it, which seems highly doubtful). The main difference between Conroe and past Pentium 4's, is Conroe has a 14-Stage Pipeline, SSE4 Instructions (Maybe), and a 4-Issue Core vs. 3-Issue in past CPU's. Conroe is all 65nm and 45nm in the future. The Unified L2 Cache of Conroe is causing it's Real-World performance to diminish, severely. Programs and Applications can and will compete for Cache Area and thus cause lots of problems for Conroe in Server Environments and Heavy Multi-Tasking environments.

Current Conroe offerings (Not yet released):

Short and sweet, yet highly doubtful?!? Hmmm....

Quote :

XII. AM2 Processors [Sockets: 940]:

The next Athlon 64 CPU's will be on Socket AM2, which as 940 pins. One thing to note is that AM2 is not pin compatible w/ Opteron 64 940 CPU's. Socket AM2 will use DDR2 and bring 65nm CPU's. AM2 will also incorporate a new technology called Z-RAM and others, which will increase the size of the Cache to enormous amounts, keep Segregated Cache (which keeps away Cache Thrashing, Competition, etc.) and SGoI, which will bring 40% increase in performance for AM2 and offer up to 4GHz Operation. Current Socket AM2 offerings (Not available yet):

WooHoo!!! Are you sure a 40% improvement going to AM2 from 939 at same clockspeed?!? And surely AMD is going past 4GHz on AM2?!? When, this year, or early next?
AMD's AM2 then it seems from this will wipe Conroe's A$$ in the dirt and is sure going to put a wet blanket on Conroe's launch, since AM2 will launch first with blazing performance making sense that Conroe will cost half as much to purchase. :roll: :roll: :roll:

Reply to RichPLS

Quote :

VI. Conroe Processors [Sockets: 775]:

The Next Generation for Desktop CPU's from Intel is the "Conroe". "Conroe" will sport DDR2, and FSB's ranging from 800MHz, 1066MHz, and 1333MHz for the Extreme Edition. Clock Speeds from 2.4GHz up to 3.33GHz in the Extreme Edition (Provided Intel can make it, which seems highly doubtful). The main difference between Conroe and past Pentium 4's, is Conroe has a 14-Stage Pipeline, SSE4 Instructions (Maybe), and a 4-Issue Core vs. 3-Issue in past CPU's. Conroe is all 65nm and 45nm in the future. The Unified L2 Cache of Conroe is causing it's Real-World performance to diminish, severely. Programs and Applications can and will compete for Cache Area and thus cause lots of problems for Conroe in Server Environments and Heavy Multi-Tasking environments.

Current Conroe offerings (Not yet released):

Short and sweet, yet highly doubtful?!?

Quote :

XII. AM2 Processors [Sockets: 940]:

The next Athlon 64 CPU's will be on Socket AM2, which as 940 pins. One thing to note is that AM2 is not pin compatible w/ Opteron 64 940 CPU's. Socket AM2 will use DDR2 and bring 65nm CPU's. AM2 will also incorporate a new technology called Z-RAM and others, which will increase the size of the Cache to enormous amounts, keep Segregated Cache (which keeps away Cache Thrashing, Competition, etc.) and SGoI, which will bring 40% increase in performance for AM2 and offer up to 4GHz Operation. Current Socket AM2 offerings (Not available yet):

WooHoo!!! Are you sure a 40% improvement going to AM2 from 939 at same clockspeed?!? And surely AMD is going past 4GHz on AM2?!? When, this year, or early next?

1. It does seem highly doubtful, given the architecture and cost

2. Look at Strained Silicon, it allows FX's to overclock to insane speeds such as 4GHz with a Clawhammer 130nm FX-55

Anything else?

~~Mad Mod Mike, pimpin' the world 1 rig at a time

Reply to MadModMike

Just the information coming from multiple sources of good repute indicate otherwise, and you yourself do not know these to be factual, for the evidence thereof is contradictory, which indicates this is your opinion, and tainted with bias in your writings.

Reply to RichPLS

To your defense tho, I have seen a blog from a guy with a grudge supporting your claims...

Reply to RichPLS

Quote :

To your defense tho, I have seen a blog from a guy with a grudge supporting your claims...

There's a difference between Unproven Claims, and Proven Claims...so far, AMD has proven it's superior....and truth be told, the Future usually reminices on the Past.

~~Mad Mod Mike, pimpin' the world 1 rig at a time

Reply to MadModMike

:twisted: AM2 HAS NOT PROVEN ITSELF SUPERIOR!

Reply to RichPLS

Hi Mike,
Thank you for the updated "review". I was wondering - without reading all the comments :oops: why you recommend the 64X2 4400+ over the 64X2 3800+. I actually also wanted to get that but after studying various benchmarks and reading comments it seems that the plus in cache does not make a difference and the plus in frequency is too expensive. What is your view on this?

Reply to juro

Well, "I" prefer the 4400+...cause it's what I have Benchmarks I've seen show a big diff in the 3800+ and the 4400+, but that was 6 months ago when I looked so...has something changed?

Also--I'm an AMD guy. Not a fanboy--but as of this moment, if you need a server--Opterons are better in almost every area when compared to Xeons. Athlon 64s are better in almost every area comparing to Pentium 4's and Pentium D's. Even the AMD Turions beat the Pentium M CPUs--although there is not a 'clear' victor in that race.

Quote :

VI. Conroe Processors [Sockets: 775]:

The Next Generation for Desktop CPU's from Intel is the "Conroe". "Conroe" will sport DDR2, and FSB's ranging from 800MHz, 1066MHz, and 1333MHz for the Extreme Edition. Clock Speeds from 2.4GHz up to 3.33GHz in the Extreme Edition (Provided Intel can make it, which seems highly doubtful). The main difference between Conroe and past Pentium 4's, is Conroe has a 14-Stage Pipeline, SSE4 Instructions (Maybe), and a 4-Issue Core vs. 3-Issue in past CPU's. Conroe is all 65nm and 45nm in the future. The Unified L2 Cache of Conroe is causing it's Real-World performance to diminish, severely. Programs and Applications can and will compete for Cache Area and thus cause lots of problems for Conroe in Server Environments and Heavy Multi-Tasking environments.

Current Conroe offerings (Not yet released):

I must agree with earlier posts. The bolded phrases imply bias, and it may not be intentional on your part, but just the appearence of bias can be considered such. Not a problem for me--but if this is to be a stickey, it needs to be free even from the appearence of bias. Do you need those bolded phrases? Perhaps rewording them is all you need to do. If you want a stickey--I would recommend doing something. If you don't, then the bias isn't a big deal, other than the fact that you claim it is unbiased.

The second statement says it IS causing real-world performance to diminish, but the real-world doesn't have the cpu available yet. Just remove the "is" and put "looks to" or something. Or whatever. I'm used to being objective even if reading bias, so it doesn't matter to me...

Reply to bourgeoisdude

I put more faith in AnandTech and Victor Wang than the ramblings of a madman's blog fuming bs without any proof... other than spite...

Either way you believe, we all will know the truth, sooner than later...
Before AM2 hits the streets, there will be several more genuine reputable benchmarks on Conroe, and AM2... Time will tell, and in a good way...

Reply to RichPLS

I put more faith in AnandTech and Victor Wang than the ramblings of a madman's blog fuming bs without any proof... other than spite...

Either way you believe, we all will know the truth, sooner than later...
Before AM2 hits the streets, there will be several more genuine reputable benchmarks on Conroe, and AM2... Time will tell, and in a good way...

Reply to RichPLS

I put more faith in AnandTech and Victor Wang than the ramblings of a madman's blog fuming bs without any proof... other than spite...

Either way you believe, we all will know the truth, sooner than later...
Before AM2 hits the streets, there will be several more genuine reputable benchmarks on Conroe, and AM2... Time will tell, and in a good way...

Reply to RichPLS

Quote :

I put more faith in AnandTech and Victor Wang than the ramblings of a madman's blog fuming bs without any proof... other than spite...

Either way you believe, we all will know the truth, sooner than later...
Before AM2 hits the streets, there will be several more genuine reputable benchmarks on Conroe, and AM2... Time will tell, and in a good way...

Triple post??? (remove the duplicates and ill remove this)

Reply to bourgeoisdude

Wow, I am using IE 7.05 beta and it sometimes hangs, causing me to hit refresh to get response back. I guess this must have caused the posts...
The php sw usually catches that...

Reply to RichPLS

Funny I use the latest IE 7 public beta and have no problems like that...is 7.05 the version that was released in March? Or is it only an msdn subscriber thing?

Reply to bourgeoisdude

don't know...

Reply to RichPLS

Quote :

I put more faith in AnandTech and Victor Wang than the ramblings of a madman's blog fuming bs without any proof... other than spite...

Either way you believe, we all will know the truth, sooner than later...
Before AM2 hits the streets, there will be several more genuine reputable benchmarks on Conroe, and AM2... Time will tell, and in a good way...

Oh boy the whole scooby-doo and gang are out today, yikes!

When I saw the "Conroe benchmarks" of IDF, I said Conroe was faster, now I say Conroe sucks and you get all emotional .

~~Mad Mod Mike, pimpin' the world 1 rig at a time

Reply to MadModMike

Thanx alot 4 the useful infooos

Reply to waelt

Quote :

Hi Mike,
Thank you for the updated "review". I was wondering - without reading all the comments :oops: why you recommend the 64X2 4400+ over the 64X2 3800+. I actually also wanted to get that but after studying various benchmarks and reading comments it seems that the plus in cache does not make a difference and the plus in frequency is too expensive. What is your view on this?

Good point, and I will tell you why:

I chose that based before I did tests myself to prove that the extra cache doesn't make a big enough difference. But, the larger cache will be best in the end for overclocking, and here's why: When you overclock, usually you overclock your RAM with your CPU and thus that means increasing the Timings of the RAM. Now, with the Integrated Memory Controller you need the best timings possible for maximum performance, and the extra cache helps aid with higher timings.

So, if you're going for extreme overclocks of RAM with 3-4-4-8 or higher timings, the extra cache will aid in more memory bandwidth & efficiency, otherwise, grab yourself the X2 3800+ and you'll be damned happy, it performs great for me.

~~Mad Mod Mike, pimpin' the world 1 rig at a time

Reply to MadModMike

@MadModMike, ok, so - as I do not want to overclock - the 3800+ is to be recommended?
I am planing to use an ASUS A8N32 SLI DELUXE (and ASUS A8N SLI Premium for my friend) - so what cpu cooler would you recommend?

Reply to juro

Quote :

@MadModMike, ok, so - as I do not want to overclock - the 3800+ is to be recommended?
I am planing to use an ASUS A8N32 SLI DELUXE (and ASUS A8N SLI Premium for my friend) - so what cpu cooler would you recommend?

Yea, the 3800+ X2 is a great chip, since you aren't overclocking, the stock heatsink/fan will work just fine for you.

~~Mad Mod Mike, pimpin' the world 1 rig at a time

Reply to MadModMike

Update. I removed all content that some found to be Biased and replaced it with passive words, and put some factual information of benchmarks to new parts and old parts. If anything is wrong or you see something else that's not right, drop a post here and I'll be happy to fix it.

~~Mad Mod Mike, pimpin' the world 1 rig at a time

Reply to MadModMike

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The Ultimate Hardware Guide [Last Update: 4-14-06] - Page 5

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