Tom's Hardware > Forum > Graphic & Displays > Nvidia > 8800 GTS? for MS Flight SimX. But which???
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PhxKen wrote :

I'm still confused as to why Intel says the x48 is DDR3 only. Obviously something's amiss.

Nothing is amiss. Intel makes X48 with DDR3 only. Other MB Mfgrs make X48s with DDR2 or DDR3. There is no real advantage to DDR3 boards as far as performance goes which is why DDR2 X48s seem to be more popular.
And don't worry about trying to match CPU and MB FSB. The MB will always run at the speed of the CPU anyway. And OC'ing raises the FSB. Overclocking isn't quite as technical as you probably imagine. It's optional and not something you need to do right away. You can get the same performance increase by turning down graphics options as you can by overclocking (actually more by backing off the very high graphics).
It's an easy way of getting the performance of a $1000 CPU at a bargain price.

Aftermarket CPU cooler is what allows you to OC without the CPU temps going through the roof. The Intel stock cooler is fine if you're not looking at OC'ing at some point down the line.
ZEROtherm ZEN FZ120 120mm CPU Cooler $44 (before $30 rebate) is an excellent cooler at a bargain price. It comes with it's own retention bracket so nothing extra to buy. Xigmatek S1283 is slightly better in max cooling ability and Zen 120 is a bit quieter at high power settings.

Rampage Formula vs P5E Deluxe vs - -?? GIGABYTE GA-EP45-UD3P P45 motherboard $137 (before $20 rebate).
In much the same way you're not choosing a more expensive CPU or RAM you can spend less on a motherboard and move the savings over to another area. Maybe a more efficient PSU? Antec earthwatts EA430 430W 80 PLUS PSU $40. A more efficient can pay for it's higher cost over time. And the Antec EA430 has as much power on the all important +12v supply as the CM Extreme 500. Ideally, I'd like to see you get a PSU that had two PCI-e power connectors (1x6 pin and 1x8 /6+2) and a bit more power for possible future upgrading.

Online play in open multiplayer games is more likely to have disruptive players (mostly language/taunting, etc) than a game involving friends over password protected voice comms.

Reply to WR2
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I don't think I've repeated questions other than the Intel thing saying x48 was DDR3 only; Intel's words, not mine. Obviously something was amiss. You've answered it convincingly, thanks. Yes, I'm plagued with perfectionist, anal tendencies sometimes wanting to nail everything down just so and not muck things up via being too shy to question. Sorry. Would need a brain transplant to change that. ;-) Thanks for the mucho detailed help here.

"while your aircraft's engine(s) is/are making a hell of a racket, totally drowning out your computer. And you're concerned about a quiet PSU?"

If you're talking about FSX's aircraft engines? within the game, I can regulate that with speaker volume, no? Haven't got FSX yet, btw. And playing FSX will be a minor % of computer use time I imagine. So, yes, having the rest of the system quiet would be a nice goal. But since I'm entering into new territory here with over-clocking, beefed up system fans... is it an impossible goal to still have a quiet system? PSU are high on the list for noise reduction, no?

Intel touts the x48 has optional "Intel Quiet System Technology" which I think refers to regulation of the system fans, throttling them down in times of little need? I suppose the fans/components, in turn, need to be built to take advantage of that feature? Or is an auto feature Intel touts?

I thought I read somewhere the 8800 GTS 512MB card was quiet? True/False? 9800 GT?

What is the watt, amp requirements of the system? What's the min power in the PSU? (If I went, in the future, to two monitors... down the road)

If I went Q6600, vs the Q9550, is Intel still producing future Core 2 Quads, where I could upgrade in the future cheaply, when the new Quad chips fall in price? Or is it the end of the Quad line, and Intel is now into producing only new i7 chips?

Mucho grande headway is being made. My questions are truly narrowing down. This is great feedback. THANKS!

Reply to PhxKen

Comp, I'm not saying Intel/nvidia parts don't deliver as far as performance goes for these purposes, however with new CPUs coming up in the next week or two at better prices, I think it's fair to wait and see if they deliver on what was promised. The worst thing about buying a new build is when you end up having buyer's remorse because a superior new product (allegedly superior anyway) was just released right after you put together your new PC.

 

And to answer your question, Core 2 line up is reaching End of Life within the next year, intel's future production will be mostly if not all based on Core i7 (and upcoming Core i5) products.

 

My take on this is to follow Computronix advice on everything except the CPU until AMD releases the Phenom II, if Phenom II ends up being as fast or even slightly faster than current 45nm Core 2, then it'll be a better deal as far as price/performance goes (even if the CPU itself is a bit more expensive), since higher end AMD motherboards are far more affordable than intel based ones.

 


Message edited by emp on 12-30-2008 at 05:07:24 AM
Reply to emp

WR2,

The Asus boards have tighter Vdroop characteristics than the Gigabyte boards, which of course is an asset for achieving the highest stable overclock. Also, the P45 boards are paired with the ICH10R Southbridge Chipset, which takes a step backward in hard drive performance. I can't find the link at the moment, but Tom's wrote an article in perhaps July or August, comparing the new P45 boards with the X48 boards. Since hard drives are the slowest critical components in a computer, the article raised my red flag regarding ICH10R performance compaired to the ICH9R.

PhxKen,

Cool always comes before quiet, however, while a quiet FSX rig can be built using the proper selection of parts and software, if quiet is your highest priority, then it'll cost you overclock, and therefore, frame rate.

Concering graphics card cooling, and how it can affect overall system cooling, the last thing you want in your case is a graphics card which polutes the inside of your case by recirculating it's own heat. Graphics cards which use a dual-slot rear-exhaust cooling solution, are always preferred when you're trying to keep a highly overclocked CPU nice and cool. Since graphics cards of the same model, including the 9800 GT, are available with single slot or dual slot cooling solutions, it's necessary to pay close attention to what you're buying.

Also, I've measured power consumtion in Watts at the PSU power plug, which can peak at 385 Watts while running FSX.

Regarding upgrtadability, as emp has pointed out, socket 775 has reached the end of the road with the Q9000 series. The i7 processors are socket 1336, which are not available in dual cores.

Incidentally, as has been asked, you still haven't mentioned a budget, so I may have spent a considerable amount of time just spinning my wheels on your behalf. So how much do you want to spend, and what are your priorities?

Message quoted 1 times
Message edited by CompuTronix on 12-30-2008 at 05:23:58 AM
Reply to CompuTronix

I'll spend what's necessarily practical. i.e., RAID, no, not at this time. Pretty much all else is reasonable. Except, why do I need the backup hard drive? Cheap enough I guess. Never had backup. Stupid, I know. Are there auto backup programs that kick the backup hard drive into simple scheduled action?

I'm apt to up components if anything, given my nature. But I might go with the Q6600 given your strong recommendation to try to bring some price/preformance savings into the quest. This system will pale in price to actual flight lessons, so I'm trying to bring reason too to expenditure. Learning should be more concrete via FSX and is there for practice, reinforcement. First chapter of the FSX book said modern avionics instruments have skyrocketed in complexity along with their learning curve... compared to yesteryear's planes. FSX appears well suited to spending time learning without air or instructor time, and prior to & after lessons taught by instructor. This is Mucho Grande bigtime help, CompuTronix, and everyone. Thanks. I'm digesting all the components and NewEgg's alts, ie, PSUs. I just need to put this behind me and pull triggers. This is consuming me too much. This help has expedited matters GREATLY. Questions have diminished. Might have a few more while I'm at NewEgg.

WR2's answer regarding Intel only making DDR3 x48 mobo's makes sense. They do, but they licence/sell the chipsets, so Intel should not be so damn dogmatic about using "only" regarding their chipset standards. By repeating that one question... I did get to the bottom of it! ;-) With helpful responses and answers. Thanks.

Reply to PhxKen

Take another look at the parts list. I upgraded the PSU, which also increased the system price.


Message edited by CompuTronix on 12-30-2008 at 06:41:37 AM
Reply to CompuTronix

CompuTronix wrote :

The Asus boards have tighter Vdroop characteristics than the Gigabyte boards, which of course is an asset for achieving the highest stable overclock. Also, the P45 boards are paired with the ICH10R Southbridge Chipset, which takes a step backward in hard drive performance.

I agree with that but I also think the "highest stable overclock" equals a system pushed to it's limit. How much extra performance is there dragging that last bit of performance out of a system? IMO the "highest stable overclock" philosophy doesnt always give you that great a return in performance. Im my FSX system when I had my E6400 OC'd to 3.2Ghz I had only 2-3 FPS more performance than at 2.8Ghz where I run it 24/7. Adjusting the autogen density gave me back the same 2-3 FPS gain at 2.8Ghz that I'd seen at 3.2 without any noticeable different in graphics quality.

The Corsair 550VX is a nice PSU. And it has free shipping compared to the estimated $10 shipping charge of the CM PSU. Hmmmmmmm..... for some reason the Corsair 650TX is only $2 more than the 550VX. And maybe the deal of the moment is that PC P&C 750W PSU for $70 after rebate. Besides the upgrade readiness a larger PSU can delay the onset of higher PSU fan speeds since it doesn't work so hard producing the power your system actually consumes. Lots of nice options at the moment.


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