AMD Mantle: A Graphics API Tested In Depth

Features
By Don Woligroski
published

AMD's Mantle is available to users of certain Radeon cards, as are the first few titles with corresponding API support. We gathered up a number of CPUs and graphics boards, fired up Battlefield 4 and Thief, and set off on a benchmarking odyssey.

Battlefield 4 Benchmarks: Entry-Level Graphics

Next, the Radeon R7 250X and GeForce GTX 650 demonstrate what lower-end discrete cards can do. We put pressure on them by increasing the detail preset to High and increase resolution to 1920x1080.

Alright, there are a lot of bars and a lot of lines in the two charts above. But what they're basically telling us is that Mantle hurts performance, rather than helps.

We contacted AMD about our numbers, and company representatives let us know that Battlefield 4 has a specific issue with Mantle that is triggered on cards with less than 4 GB of memory. The Radeon R7 250X we tested has 1 GB. The GeForce GTX 650 has 2 GB, though of course that's not Mantle-compatible. I'll get into more depth on the issue shortly. But for now, let's have a look at frame time variance.

Variance is in the acceptable range; none of the cards demonstrate more than 3 ms at the 95th percentile. There are a few spikes, but nothing to cause alarm.

Don Woligroski
107 Comments Comment from the forums
  • damric
    Wow, Don. This is a good read. You must have plagiarized it from some somewhere :D


    Nice, Damric. nice. :)
    Reply
  • Amdlova
    memory problems... so my 260x with 1gb will sufferrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr
    Reply
  • Memnarchon
    Mantle is not glide. 3DFX had 85% of the GPU share when they had glide so it was easier for developers to use the glide (AMD has 35% right now).
    But Mantle did something really good for gamers. Till now Microsoft with no competition didn't gave too much attention in performance optimising the DirectX. They gave Microsoft a reason to improve DirectX (so they will bring DX12) in the way mantle works. This benefits all the gamers.
    Unfortunately I have a feeling that Microsoft will give DirectX12 only with Windows9 (due to kernel limitations at their pockets).
    If this will be true then Mantle might have more life than most users expected to (since it wil take time for windows 9 to rule the market share)...
    Reply
  • ZolaIII
    Next Open GL specification is almost redy & will be announced next month in (ironically) Vancouver Canada. Naturally it will be available on all platforms (that want to integrate OGL) & it will be addressing lover overheads. As gaming market is getting more fragmented it's getting natural to develop for api that can run on all platforms.
    Reply
  • tomfreak
    Is the battlefield 4 tested in multi-player?


    It was tested in single player, as its easier to get consistent results. We're trying to eliminate variables except the graphics engine as much as possible.
    Reply
  • chaosmassive
    "AMD Mantle: AMD's PhysX "

    please do a research what is Mantle before post
    it seems you don't understand what are you writing about.


    I think the problem may be that you don't understand the context of the answer, which does not equate Mantle with PhysX on a technical level.

    We equate Mantle with PhysX in the sense that it's a value-add that assists in a limited number of games. Its not a universal advantage.
    Reply
  • abundantcores
    User testing around the Internet shows Intel are at least as fast in Mantle as AMD CPUs.

    Its obvious there is something very wrong with your testing.


    Actually, nobody on the internet has really tested anything but Radeon R9 290s when it comes to Mantle. Instead of assuming it always works in every situation like everyone else, we actually tested it, not only with the 290, but with a wide range of CPUs and GPUs. We did this with feedback from AMD.

    Mantle is not the perfect, slick API that people assume it is. AMD stresses that its considered a beta and is not yet a final product.

    I believe that our test results are quite accurate. The problem is that the API, something the developer considers unfinished at this point, probably still needs work and has room to grow. And I'm sure it will get better over time.

    But pretending it works 100% perfectly doesn't help anyone. That's not even something that AMD would try to say at this time as it has obvious issues. They are working on it. But there is a value to in-depth testing and to sharing the inconsistencies.
    i7 with 4 cores and 8 threads right here http://forums.overclockers.co.uk/showthread.php?p=26614553#post26614553

    Using your settings.

    Min 62 FPS
    Max 82 FPS

    here is one with a 4770K @ 4.5Ghz

    Avenged7Fold: 290X @ 1300/1604, 4770K @ 4.5Ghz - Mantle FPS: Min 71.8 / Avr 88.5. http://forums.overclockers.co.uk/showpost.php?p=26380265&postcount=291

    That ^^^ is actually on the highest possible settings.

    I know a lot of people using i7's with mantle, in Thief and BF4, some with CF 290's, they all report FPS gains with Mantle over DX, especially when in CF. in BF4 averaging 170 FPS with 120 FPS minimums. over 50% higher than they do in DX.

    I don't know where you have gone wrong. but everyone on our forum is utterly confused by your i7 results.

    http://forums.overclockers.co.uk/showthread.php?t=18611853
    Reply
  • ta152h
    As a programmer of 30 years, that's arguably the worst description of an API I have heard.

    An API is a set of commands, with required parameters, a software package presents to another application that wishes to use its services. It's essentially the language to use the services it provides.

    Mantle isn't just an API. It's an abstraction layer that makes it unnecessary for the developer to write directly to the hardware, which is tedious, time-consuming and extremely difficult to do on a large product. The API is what Mantle accepts to tell it what to do, and what the programmer must learn to use it, but it is NOT all Mantle is. It's just how to talk to it.

    A pure API would be something someone demented would write, because it would mean you could issue commands to do nothing. I'm guessing Apple is patenting this technology now.


    I'm sorry you feel that way. I don't agree as I feel it's a useful high-level primer for folks who haven't been programming for 30 years, but you're certainly entitled to your opinion. :)
    Reply
  • elbert
    On page 4 its clear mantle doesn't work well with Intel's Hyper-Threading but what about Intel's 6 core CPU's? Does mantle give an Intel 6 core a bigger advantage in games that dx? I wouldn't throw mantle under the bus just due to its unoptimized for Hyper-Threading. Please add an Intel's 6 core to these tests.
    Reply
  • SteelCity1981
    I can see intel supporting mantle in its future gpu hardware. I mean just recently intel asked amd for its mantles api specs. So intel using mantle in the future is much more plausible then Nvidia using mantle.
    Reply