Ads
Ads
All about Software
 Latest Software articles
Benchmarking Windows 7: Harder, Better, Faster, Stronger?

Benchmarking Windows 7: Harder, Better, Faster, Stronger?
Often hailed as the solution to Windows Vista performance problems, we wanted to know just how much better Windows 7 really is. We put one of our most recent test platforms through its paces to find out, benchmarking raw performance and responsiveness. Read More

  • How To: Windows XP Mode In...Ubuntu Linux?
    Windows 7's XP Mode has already convinced many users who sat out for Vista to go out and upgrade. But will they buy the right version of Windows 7 to get XPM? You do know you can get the same XP functionality from a Linux distribution for free, right? Read More
All Software articles

Newsletters


  • Ask your question about IT issues
  • Post
Popular Searches

Partners

The Games selection

violent : More Mindless Violence Basic shooting game, but still so powerful! Use the mouse to take aim and shoot at the little beasties before they get to you. Use Space to reload....
action : Yoyo the Star Yoyo is a young girl who recently graduated and dreams to become a movie star (don't we all). You'll have to guide her on the path to stardom,...
Ads

Sponsored links

Microsoft Wants 5% Cut of Each New Windows PC

Next news
12:31 PM - September 17, 2009 by Marcus Yam

It's the Microsoft tax.

Microsoft has historically been rather hush hush when it comes to it's share in the sale of a new PC that includes an OEM copy of Windows, but one general manager of Corporate Strategy at Microsoft revealed some interesting figures.

While none of this information is official, and we're sure that Windows licensing costs vary from one OEM to the next depending on negotiate deals, it seems that Microsoft takes about $50 per PC that costs around $1000.

"If you think of the $1,000 PC, which has kind of been the benchmark for the last decade or so, then we've always charged about $50 for the copy of Windows for that PC," Songhurst revealed at the Jefferies Annual Technology Conference, as reported by Ars Technica.

"So that's five percent. So if you think about charging $100, $200 or if you think about a super high-end PC, you know the Sony Vaios or anything that's there for around the $1000 mark, or the Alienware PCs that are even higher, if we can get that constant percentage then we should be indifferent to the number five points in the market," Songhurst continued.

Clearly, taking a $50 cut from a $300 netbook is something that most OEMs would probably find to be disadvantageous, which would make one think that alternative operating systems such as Ubuntu would have the upper hand. But Microsoft seems to think that it would be happy if it could score five percent from every new PC sale, particularly with the increased range of PC prices with the advent of netbooks and $300 laptops at Wal-Mart.

Source : Tom's Hardware US

Talkback
Add your comment
cadder 09/17/2009 6:55 PM
Hide
-12+

5% seems like it would be in the consumer's favor. And why do they charge so much for the retail versions of the OS? I figure the average home PC is probably closer to $500 than $1000, so if they receive $25 for the license for the OS on that machine, why do they charge $100 or more at retail for the same thing?

I'm sure they have figured this out better than we have, but it seems like they would prefer a sliding scale with higher than 5% for the low end computers and less than 5% for the upper end computers.

How many computers are sold to business users for significantly higher than $1000? Maybe there are enough of these sold that they want their 5% of the higher prices.

pharge 09/17/2009 6:55 PM
Hide
-1+

hmmm... I am confused... Shouldn't MS charged the OEM based on the version of OS installed not on the price of the computer?

Since most of the computers (desktop or laptop... except netbooks) have Vista home/enterprice installed... will these percentage still 5%? or this is just the average?

broketechjunkie 09/17/2009 6:57 PM
Show
ethanolson 09/17/2009 6:59 PM
Hide
-3+

They're exactly opposite of Apple. The MS OS costs less when bundled with the hardware but more on the shelves. Apple is the other way around where you're paying a ton for the OS because of the controlled hardware for it... but it's cheaper than MS Windows if you buy it on the shelf.

bustapr 09/17/2009 7:01 PM
Show
ethanolson 09/17/2009 7:02 PM
Hide
-10+

I work for HP and the price is different based on the version. His 5% number sounds like it's 90% home editions... leading me to believe he commented with retail stats.

I know that MS gets about $15-25 per XP Home on a netbook... which is a little more than 5%, but they get more for their business/pro editions.

Andraxxus 09/17/2009 7:07 PM
Hide
--2+

Well they aren't called M$ for nothing.

thackstonns 09/17/2009 7:10 PM
Hide
-1+

bustapr :
Since pc manufacturers aren't going to like this, I imagine this would make for a good moment for pc manufacturers to consider linux. It'll be way cheaper and they wouldn't have to worry about warranty issues, since most pcs are sent back due to virus crashes. They'll save a lot of money.



except then alot of people would be using Linux and everyone would start writing virus's for it. Of course then Microsoft could claim its secure. I hate it when people go oh well linux is secure, oh well apple is secure. Yep they are cause no one is going to try to steal information 2% of the computer market. They are going to focus on the other 98%.

jellico 09/17/2009 7:14 PM
Hide
-0+

Well, 5% on the cost of a computer for an OEM computer of the operating system seems pretty reasonable. It costs me a lot more when I buy an OEM copy from Newegg when I put together a new system. Unfortunately, I doubt small-scale retail system builders can get an OEM distribution license.

domenic 09/17/2009 7:20 PM
Hide
-2+

bustapr :
Since pc manufacturers aren't going to like this,....



Why are pc manufacturers not going to like this? Do you think they expect to get windows for free? 5% sounds very reasonable to me.

Pei-chen 09/17/2009 7:21 PM
Hide
-10+

cadder :
5% seems like it would be in the consumer's favor. And why do they charge so much for the retail versions of the OS? I figure the average home PC is probably closer to $500 than $1000, so if they receive $25 for the license for the OS on that machine, why do they charge $100 or more at retail for the same thing?


Two words; customer support.

If you buy retail and has a problem, it is MS' job to assist you. If you have a Dell, it is Dell's job to assist you. If you bought an OEM disc from newegg, it is your job to provide customer support.

amnotanoobie 09/17/2009 7:22 PM
Hide
-2+

cadder :
And why do they charge so much for the retail versions of the OS?



A manufacturer could state to Microsoft how much they'd be needing in the next month or so, which would mean a stable income for Microsoft. (Plus manufacturers buy thousands of copies at a time) With retail however there is no guarantee how much you'd be able to sell at a given point in time.


The fact also that Microsoft is the sole provider of Windows might have also something to do with the retail price.

ssddx 09/17/2009 7:22 PM
Hide
-0+

A sliding scale with 5% as an average isn't all that bad. Microsoft can get away with the low price since it most assuredly gains quantity. The reason retail is so pricey is to make pure profit, which also explains why MS is happy with a 5% figure.

PC OEMs will continue to use MS no matter what deal they are cut. The general populous works and plays with windows; this means that if they cut out windows and start with linux they will lose a vast majority of sales. Then keep in mind the compatability issues to be had with a non-windows OS.

ssddx 09/17/2009 7:23 PM
Hide
-0+

amnotanoobie.. beat me too it..

+1

smlong 09/17/2009 7:31 PM
Hide
-11+

"Microsoft tax."

Obviously this article is using that phrase as the "Apple tax" is so popular. It's a shame the author is completely clueless as to why the phrase "Apple tax" is even used. Charging $25-$50 for an OS is not a tax. I would say it's the complete opposite. It is bordering on FREE. I paid more than that for L4D.

jarnail24 09/17/2009 7:34 PM
Hide
-3+

Hold up this article is so misleading. Microsoft doesn't want to raise it to 5% microsoft already gets 5%. This was with an interview with a microsoft employee about how much they charge for a license to oems. This article is making it sound like microsoft is raising their prices which they're not, they're just letting the consumer know how much they charge for the first time.

redgarl 09/17/2009 7:49 PM
Hide
--2+

I hate Microsoft... what else can I say after actually purchasing Windows Millenium...

Anonymous 09/17/2009 7:52 PM
Hide
-0+

Microsoft are still cunts that charge way too much for many things, but to call Windows on a retail PC "the MS tax" is just retarded. The various/server enterprise products are priced ridiculously high. In contrast, OSX costs about the same as the base hardware, heaven forbid you want a RAM upgrade.

In all fairness though, it's my understanding that Rabbi Jobs does personally bless each stick of RAM that goes in a Mac, which somewhat justifies the price. /sarcasm

cabose369 09/17/2009 7:58 PM
Hide
--2+

If Microsoft forces Manufacturers of computers to pay another $50 per Windows License all that is going to mean for consumers is that every computer is now going to go up in price at least $50.

LAME!!!

manjyomethunder 09/17/2009 8:07 PM
Hide
-4+

"It's the Microsoft tax."

I didn't realize that when I bought something, I was paying all tax and not like, a price. I had no idea that things didn't like, have value. How dare Microsoft charge for it's products.

manjyomethunder 09/17/2009 8:08 PM
Hide
-2+

cabose369 :
If Microsoft forces Manufacturers of computers to pay another $50 per Windows License all that is going to mean for consumers is that every computer is now going to go up in price at least $50.LAME!!!



Learn to read the article, 5% is the cost of the actual license for the copy of Windows. Not an additional cost over the license.

Anonymous 09/17/2009 8:20 PM
Hide
-1+

Like jarnail24 said, M$ is just stating how much they currently get from OEMs. However, I wonder if this is just for certain agreements. I worked several years for an IT company that almost exclusively built computers for its clients. (This was back when it was cost-effective to do so. Nowadays IT companies usually just resell Dell or HP products, or the clients work with said OEMs directly.)

If the client didn't have an Open License agreement, we bought OEM licenses and media for ~$130-$140 each for Win2k or XP. There was no 5% additional charge. If the 5% is referring to the cost of each OEM license, then we were paying almost three times that. If Dell and HP only pay $50 per license, then they are getting a substantial discount.

megamanx00 09/17/2009 8:33 PM
Hide
-0+

Too bad we can't get an OEM copy for $50 :D. Well at least a COA or something. Ah well such is life.

megamanx00 09/17/2009 8:36 PM
Hide
-1+

cadder :
5% seems like it would be in the consumer's favor. And why do they charge so much for the retail versions of the OS? I figure the average home PC is probably closer to $500 than $1000, so if they receive $25 for the license for the OS on that machine, why do they charge $100 or more at retail for the same thing?I'm sure they have figured this out better than we have, but it seems like they would prefer a sliding scale with higher than 5% for the low end computers and less than 5% for the upper end computers.How many computers are sold to business users for significantly higher than $1000? Maybe there are enough of these sold that they want their 5% of the higher prices.



They charge so much for the retail version because of the tech support. A customer can use up alot of tech support hours on seemingly trivial issues.

SAL-e 09/17/2009 9:00 PM
Hide
-2+

quiteadiscount :
Like jarnail24 said, M$ is just stating how much they currently get from OEMs. However, I wonder if this is just for certain agreements. I worked several years for an IT company that almost exclusively built computers for its clients. (This was back when it was cost-effective to do so. Nowadays IT companies usually just resell Dell or HP products, or the clients work with said OEMs directly.)If the client didn't have an Open License agreement, we bought OEM licenses and media for ~$130-$140 each for Win2k or XP. There was no 5% additional charge. If the 5% is referring to the cost of each OEM license, then we were paying almost three times that. If Dell and HP only pay $50 per license, then they are getting a substantial discount.


Thank you for sharing that. Some time ago I posted this and some guy called me a liar. Now every one knows that OEM version soled at Neweeg is simply retail version without support from MS. I used to be small builder my self and the only way to get real discount from MS was by signing exclusive contract with them. In other words not to sell PC without OS, with Linux or other OS. So It is MS tax of 5% to any Linux user if this user can't get 5% discount from OEM for PC without OS.

supertrek32 09/17/2009 9:50 PM
Hide
-1+

Yet another thing that probably benefits most customers.

Yet another thing that the EU will freak out over.

HVdynamo 09/17/2009 10:01 PM
Hide
-1+

I think they should offer a retail version without including Tech support, I never need it, and I don't want to get OEM because I want to be able to move the OS from computer to computer as I upgrade with less activation issues. I am happy with the OEM pricing, but I want more flexibility without paying for their tech support.

Hanin33 09/17/2009 10:09 PM
Hide
-3+

thackstonns :
except then alot of people would be using Linux and everyone would start writing virus's for it. Of course then Microsoft could claim its secure. I hate it when people go oh well linux is secure, oh well apple is secure. Yep they are cause no one is going to try to steal information 2% of the computer market. They are going to focus on the other 98%.



that analogy doesn't quite work since ~70% of web servers use linux or a variant that would make exploitation far more profitable... sure the install base is less but the rewards are far better...

caskachan 09/17/2009 10:10 PM
Hide
-1+

sell windows at 20% a pop and i guarantee you i will seel around 100 windows a month

caskachan 09/17/2009 10:10 PM
Hide
-0+

20$ that is!

invlem 09/17/2009 10:40 PM
Hide
-0+

So the 5% rule really isn't that bad. In effect it keeps cheap PCs and net books reasonably priced on the cheap side.

If the big OEMs had to pay $50 on a netbook for the OS prices would surely go up.

Think about it, if you buy an extreme PC for $3,000 you'd be paying a hidden charge of $150 for the OEM windows license. This would be in-line with what you'd pay if you bought the OEM version from an e-tailer. (Assuming you buy windows ultimate, which with a $3,000 PC you probably would be).


Sponsored links

Related articles

  • Over the course of its life, Windows Vista has taken a load of abuse—much of which is deserved. One area we’ve seen both Intel and AMD affected is power management. In AMD’s case, enabling Cool’n’Quiet technology on its original Phenom processors caused a sizable performance hit as Vista’s scheduler moved threads from active to idle cores running at half-speed in a process called migration. Why did it do this? In order to maintain the symmetry of a system under full load, you don’t want I/O to become dependent on just one core. If you keep threads rotating between cores running at their maximum performance (this whole concept goes out the window when you start talking about spinning cores down), you get better responsiveness. This was an implementation decision made during Microsoft’s Windows NT kernel design, and based on our experiences with both processor vendors' hardware, it wasn't considered a "feature" to either company. Of course, it affected Intel in a much different way than AMD. The problem Intel had in Vista was one of power consumption. For every migration, you have to write-combine the Nehalem architecture’s L3 cache, which costs power. This changes with Windows 7 and a feature called ideal core. If a task’s needs are being addressed by one core, the operating system will let you stay there. This means two things to Intel: first, you don’t use power on the migration, and second, idle cores are able to remain in a C6 state. Purportedly, this migration fix alone will yield an extra 10 to 15 minutes of battery life on Nehalem-based notebooks, though this won’t become a major issue until the mobile dual-core Arrandale launches later this year. Perhaps more interesting, though, is that processors without C6 will not realize this gain (including AMD’s CPUs). Core parking is a second optimization, based on the observation in previous operating systems that you might have four cores running background processes at 10% utilization each. The idea is to load all of those tasks onto one core and let the others idle if operating load levels allow for it. Now, you can see how these two features working together might have a significant impact on power, as ideal core prevents rabid thread migration, while core parking optimizes loading. Taken together, the pair intelligently maximizes the number of idle cores, and then keeps them from being spun up unnecessarily, yielding the theoretical power gains. If you want to know more about the changes incorporated into Windows 7, check out this interview with Mark Russinovich, a Technical fellow for Microsoft. We’re Making The Switch Based on reader feedback to Windows Vista, access to the final Windows 7 code, and great app compatibility with our current benchmark suite, we updated as many software versions as possible and made the leap to Windows 7 for our review here (along with the gaming analysis of CrossFire and SLI graphics configurations, published separately). But before we did, we wanted to quantify these power-saving claims from Intel for ourselves. So, we logged runs of PCMark Vantage on clean drives with an install of Windows Vista updated to Service Pack 2 and the Windows 7 RTM code, both x64 builds. The results were actually counter to what we expected. The Windows 7-based build averaged six watts higher over the course of its run, but finished the test three minutes faster than the Vista machine. Also noteworthy, though, is that when the Windows 7 machine has a chance to idle (which is where we'd expect to see ideal core and core parking actually having an effect), it does dip down lower than the Windows Vista box. We checked these results over with Intel, and came away with the following interpretation: the Windows 7 P-state promotion policies are more aggressive than Vista's, meaning a Windows 7 system ramps to Turbo Boost faster, resulting in the better performance and higher power consumption. At idle, the previously-discussed features enable the Windows 7 config to dip below the idle power draw of the Vista machine. Overall, though, Windows 7 actually averages higher power consumption in this experiment, even if it simply idles for the three minutes while the Vista box finishes its run. We are fairly certain of why, exactly, this is, but will hold off on comment until we're able to present power data substantiating the claim. However, that doesn't change the fact that, in this case, Windows 7 won't be cutting your power bill. In order to show Windows 7 cutting consumption, we'd have to spend a lot more time at idle (admittedly more representative of how most PCs are typically used), replace a certain component, or disable certain settings in the OS.

  • Operating System: Microsoft's Windows Millennium

    On September 14th Microsoft officially released Windows Millennium Edition (Win Me), Microsoft's latest consumer OS, to the public. Most of our reviews have focused on consumer level hardware so when this new OS was released, I decided that I'd move my testing over to the new OS after a bit of validation on my part. My main concern was the general loss of performance due to the bloated nature of Microsoft's newer OSes trying to create a "friendlier" user interface. I also didn't plan to waste time on a generally unstable OS for future testing either. We'll take a look at what new features this OS has to offer, run through some benchmarks and give you some general feedback on this OS. What's New? In a nutshell, Win Me is Win98 with the addition of updated digital media support, a System Restore feature, somewhat update driver support and possibly boots faster. Of that list, only two features are of any real big interest to many of us at best. The new digital media support is basically achieved through the standard addition of Media Player 7 and Microsoft Movie Maker. Media Player 7 is already available through download so it's nothing unique to Win Me. It offers digital playback of today's most popular formats as well as CD burning and ripping capabilities. MS Movie Maker is basically what it sounds like, a movie editing tool. With this tool you can create or edit home movies with or without sound. I was able to create videos with my webcam very quickly but ran into somewhat of a wall. Unfortunately there was only one format to save as, Windows Media Video Format (*.WMV). As you can imagine I was a bit annoyed but it's further evidence that Microsoft wants to be in control of more than just our OS. Still pictures can be taken or saved as JPEG only. This is obviously nothing ground breaking but it's available for free. What's New? Continued The Microsoft System Restore allows you (and windows for that matter) to backup your system at certain points in time by creating "store points." This can be handy in the case of a troublesome installation that causes instabilities. Clearly this is Microsoft's attempt at safeguarding the not so rare crashes we've come to know and love. System Restore gives you the ability to restore your machine to its previous status without too much of a hassle. I did a few minor tests with this and it seemed to work without any hitches. However, there may be a huge drawback to enabling it. After prolonged use of System Restore, my hard disk space started to mysteriously disappear. What was the source of this problem? It was the _RESTORE directory that the System Restore program uses to store information. On an early test disk, I had installed and removed a few programs for testing purposes. When I checked the total size of my restore directory after all this, it had bloated to nearly 150 MBs of backup data! Keep in mind that this disk was clean a few hours earlier. This might not directly affect 3D performance but it will seriously hinder disk performance with tons of useless data being constantly backed up on a daily basis. Another major note was the inability to have this feature enabled while running Sysmark 2000. I had left it on initially and my _Restore directory bloated to over a GIG of data! Sysmark 2000 runs were all completed with this featured disabled for obvious reasons. Some of the other minor benefits that I noticed were the expanded driver support for system devices that was built into the OS and a slightly faster boot time. I didn't require as many drivers to get my test platform going as I did with Win98SE. My boot time on a normal test disk improved by only a few seconds but faster nonetheless. One last thing to mention is that some of you may miss is the availability of "DOS" in Win Me. Although you can still get into a DOS command window through tricky methods (like Start->Run-> "command"), DOS is no longer available on any of the startup or shut down option lists. The Install Installing Win Me was a breeze for the most part aside from a few minor hiccups. The upgrade of our normal test disk took about 20 minutes. After entering the CD key, the system installed on its own for the most part. On one of the last reboots, I did hang once but a soft reboot fixed whatever happened and the install was able to complete on its own. Obviously my test platform is relatively new so others might have varying results. Performance Expectations From the changes I can see so far, I don't expect much of a change to my 3D performance results as the video drivers are basically the same and the OS shouldn't be much different aside from the newer features. The DirectX revision on the Win Me CD is newer that what you can download currently so that may provide some interesting results. The one thing I would expect to be slower is disk performance, as the System Restore seems to be a resource hog while enabled. I found that even after disabling this feature, it mysteriously toggled itself back on at times. I find this to be very disturbing. Let's hope Microsoft can offer a patch to keep this under control. 3D tests were run across various graphics cards and at the low-resolution setting of 640x480x16 to best detect performance variances between the OSes. Sysmark 2000 was only run on a GeForce2 GTS and at the 1024x768x16 resolution. This benchmark will give a good reflection of overall system and hard disk performance.

  • After unveiling Windows Vista last year, Microsoft is now releasing the server version of its operating system at this year's CeBIT alongside a new software development environment. Windows Server 2008 Windows Server 2008 is the successor to Windows Server 2003 R2 and is built around the same kernel as Windows Vista. Microsoft expects this will increase security immensely compared to the previous version Real time savers - Sensible quick links in the administration interface quickly lead you to the desired system settings. However, the most important change found in the new Windows Server is its much simpler management, thanks to the Server Manager. Whereas administrators were forced to click their way through countless wizards and assistants in previous versions, they can now manage the entire server through a single application, namely said Server Manager. This simplifies administration and saves lots of time. Your server at a glance - the Server Manager lets you keep an eye on all of the server's features. For the first time ever, the core installation comes without a graphical user interface, installing only the components necessary to perform the required tasks. This simultaneously reduces the vulnerability to security exploits and results in higher server performance coupled with a lower system load. The core installation does away with the graphica user interface. Visual Studio 2008 Microsoft has also updated its development environment Visual Studio. In the new 2008 version, not only the programming environment is compatible with Windows Vista, but programs written in the languages C++, C# and Visual Basic are as well. The Windows Platform SDK is completely up to date and already supports Windows Server 2008. The J# platform, on the other hand, is no longer a part of the new Visual Studio. Support for J# will continue throughout 2015 through Visual Studio 2005, though. The integrated development environment (IDE) of Visual Studio 2008. In addition to improved debugging capabilities, the new environment also comes with multi targeting, allowing applications to use .NET versions 2.0, 3.0 and 3.5 without requiring Visual Studio 2005 to be installed. Visual Studio 2008's debugger at work, in this case with the C++ language Visual Studio 2008 also drops support for Windows 2000, meaning the development environment is only available on Windows XP and Vista. Microsoft will once again offer so-called Express editions of Visual Studio 2008 with reduced feature sets for free that can also be used commercially. They have been available for download for a while now here. The resource editor is an exclusive part of the Professional Edition and does not come with the Express Edition. Main Microsoft stand: Hall 4, StandA26